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On Wed, Mar 21, 2012 at 5:03 AM,  <gentoo-amd64+help@l.g.o> wrote:
> Topics (messages 13110 through 13125):
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13110 - Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13111 - Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13112 - Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13113 - Cheng Renquan <crquan@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13114 - Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13115 - Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13116 - Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13117 - Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13118 - Paul Hartman <paul.hartman+gentoo@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13119 - Barry Schwartz <chemoelectric@×××××××××××××.org>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13120 - Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13121 - Barry Schwartz <chemoelectric@×××××××××××××.org>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13122 - Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13123 - Barry Schwartz <chemoelectric@×××××××××××××.org>
>
> [gentoo-amd64] Re: Kernel-3.3.0 and Nvidia-drivers
>      13124 - Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@×××.net>
>      13125 - Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@×××.net>
>
>
>
> Linux-3.3.0 is released and, as is my usual habit, I downloaded and compiled
> the plain vanilla source.
>
> After rebooting to the command console, and before starting X, I needed
> to re-install the nvidia-driver module for the new kernel.  Doing
> "emerge nvidia-drivers" gave me the following error (the entire build log
> is attached):
>
>>>> Source prepared.
>>>> Configuring source in /tmp/portage-acc/tmp/portage/x11-drivers/nvidia-drivers-295.20-r1/work ...
>>>> Source configured.
>>>> Compiling source in /tmp/portage-acc/tmp/portage/x11-drivers/nvidia-drivers-295.20-r1/work ...
> Preparing nvidia module
> make -j9 HOSTCC=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc CROSS_COMPILE=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu- 'LDFLAGS=-m elf_x86_64' IGNORE_CC_MISMATCH=yes V=1 SYSSRC=/usr/src/linux SYSOUT=/lib/modules/3.3.0/build CC=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc clean module
>
> *** Unable to determine the target kernel version. ***
>
> make: *** [select_makefile] Error 1
> emake failed
> ERROR: x11-drivers/nvidia-drivers-295.20-r1 failed (compile phase):
>  Unable to emake HOSTCC=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc CROSS_COMPILE=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu- LDFLAGS=-m elf_x86_64  IGNORE_CC_MISMATCH=yes V=1 SYSSRC=/usr/src/linux             SYSOUT=/lib/modules/3.3.0/build CC=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc clean module
>
> Call stack:
>    ebuild.sh, line   85:  Called src_compile
>  environment, line 3711:  Called linux-mod_src_compile
>  environment, line 2668:  Called die
> The specific snippet of code:
>              eval "emake HOSTCC=\"$(tc-getBUILD_CC)\"
>
>
> The first part of the build log (see attached file) indicates that the
> kernel source was correctly found (at /usr/src/linux), but for some
> reason the make process fails.
>
> Could this be due to some changes in the kernel-3.3.0 tree?
>
> Frank Peters
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net> wrote:
>> Linux-3.3.0 is released and, as is my usual habit, I downloaded and compiled
>> the plain vanilla source.
>>
> <SNIP>
>> The first part of the build log (see attached file) indicates that the
>> kernel source was correctly found (at /usr/src/linux), but for some
>> reason the make process fails.
>>
>> Could this be due to some changes in the kernel-3.3.0 tree?
>>
>> Frank Peters
>>
>
> Possibly this from Google will help?
>
> Good luck & post back,
> Mark
>
> On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:35:34 -0700
> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Possibly this from Google will help?
>>
>
> Did you intend to include a link?  If so, it must have gotten
> lost somewhere.
>
> Frank Peters
>
>
> I have switched to nouveau driver, for over 1 year,
> using with gnome3 interface, no performance issue, and quite stable,
>
> enjoying every mainline kernel 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.3, no building issue
>
>
> I think it's time for everyone to give up nvidia-drivers, the blob of binary
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net> wrote:
>> Linux-3.3.0 is released and, as is my usual habit, I downloaded and compiled
>> the plain vanilla source.
>>
>> After rebooting to the command console, and before starting X, I needed
>> to re-install the nvidia-driver module for the new kernel.  Doing
>> "emerge nvidia-drivers" gave me the following error (the entire build log
>> is attached):
>>
>>>>> Source prepared.
>>>>> Configuring source in /tmp/portage-acc/tmp/portage/x11-drivers/nvidia-drivers-295.20-r1/work ...
>>>>> Source configured.
>>>>> Compiling source in /tmp/portage-acc/tmp/portage/x11-drivers/nvidia-drivers-295.20-r1/work ...
>> Preparing nvidia module
>> make -j9 HOSTCC=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc CROSS_COMPILE=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu- 'LDFLAGS=-m elf_x86_64' IGNORE_CC_MISMATCH=yes V=1 SYSSRC=/usr/src/linux SYSOUT=/lib/modules/3.3.0/build CC=x86_64-pc-linux-gnu-gcc clean module
>>
>> *** Unable to determine the target kernel version. ***
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 12:05 PM, Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net> wrote:
>> On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:35:34 -0700
>> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Possibly this from Google will help?
>>>
>>
>> Did you intend to include a link?  If so, it must have gotten
>> lost somewhere.
>>
>> Frank Peters
>>
>>
>
> Gadzooks, yes I did. Sorry!
>
> http://weltall.heliohost.org/wordpress/2012/01/20/linux-kernel-3-3-rc1-and-nvidia-drivers/
>
> To be clear, I have no idea if it will solve your exact problem. It
> didn't for all.
>
> My experience with nvidia is pretty good if you give them a couple of
> days, but very spotty on the first or second day a new kernel minor
> rev is released. Nominally I use this page:
>
> http://www.nvidia.com/Download/indexsg.aspx?lang=en-us
>
> and then search out my specific card to determine what _exact_ driver
> they want me to run. It almost always requires i run ~amd64.
>
> HTH,
> Mark
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 12:14 PM, Cheng Renquan <crquan@×××××.com> wrote:
>> I have switched to nouveau driver, for over 1 year,
>> using with gnome3 interface, no performance issue, and quite stable,
>>
>> enjoying every mainline kernel 3.0, 3.1, 3.2, 3.3, no building issue
>>
>>
>> I think it's time for everyone to give up nvidia-drivers, the blob of binary
>>
>
> And how would one use CUDA if we gave up nvidia-drivers? Does nouveau
> support all the CUDA stuff?
>
> Cheers,
> Mark
>
> On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:35:34 -0700
> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> Possibly this from Google will help?
>>
>
> OK, I think I've found the URL that you may have intended:
>
> http://weltall.heliohost.org/wordpress/2012/01/20/linux-kernel-3-3-rc1-and-nvidia-drivers/
>
> I followed the second fix that is described and now the nvidia-drivers
> emerge and work nicely with linux kernel-3.3.
>
> Thanks for the hint.
>
> There are changes to the kernel-3.3 tree that will have to addressed
> by the gentoo nvidia-drivers or other users will hit this problem
> as well.
>
> Frank Peters
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 12:30 PM, Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net> wrote:
>> On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 09:35:34 -0700
>> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> wrote:
>>
>>>
>>> Possibly this from Google will help?
>>>
>>
>> OK, I think I've found the URL that you may have intended:
>>
>> http://weltall.heliohost.org/wordpress/2012/01/20/linux-kernel-3-3-rc1-and-nvidia-drivers/
>>
>> I followed the second fix that is described and now the nvidia-drivers
>> emerge and work nicely with linux kernel-3.3.
>>
>> Thanks for the hint.
>>
>> There are changes to the kernel-3.3 tree that will have to addressed
>> by the gentoo nvidia-drivers or other users will hit this problem
>> as well.
>>
>> Frank Peters
>>
>>
>
> Glad you found it. That is the link I just sent along and good to know
> it helped a bit.
>
> As I said, on kernel revision number changes I ALWAYS wait a minimum
> of 3-5 days before trying to upgrade. nvidia always seems to need at
> least a few days to catch up with a new release, or that's been my
> experience in the past anyway.
>
> Cheers,
> Mark
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 3:08 PM, Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> wrote:
>>
>> As I said, on kernel revision number changes I ALWAYS wait a minimum
>> of 3-5 days before trying to upgrade. nvidia always seems to need at
>> least a few days to catch up with a new release, or that's been my
>> experience in the past anyway.
>
> Same here, nvidia-drivers and vmware-modules are why I usually wait
> until the .1 release on a new kernel series. :)
>
> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> skribis:
>> And how would one use CUDA if we gave up nvidia-drivers? Does nouveau
>> support all the CUDA stuff?
>
> I think they may have reverse engineered CUDA, but whether it is
> implemented I don’t know, and I wouldn’t want to be the one to test
> it, either. :)
>
> I’m donating processor time with boinc and that’s good enough reason
> to use the binary driver if it gives me more processor to donate.
>
> (Waiting before installing anything new is painful, I know, because
> with Gentoo you always feel like you want it to be doing something, or
> at least that’s my experience. :) )
>
> On Mon, Mar 19, 2012 at 2:28 PM, Barry Schwartz
> <chemoelectric@×××××××××××××.org> wrote:
>> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> skribis:
>>> And how would one use CUDA if we gave up nvidia-drivers? Does nouveau
>>> support all the CUDA stuff?
>>
>> I think they may have reverse engineered CUDA, but whether it is
>> implemented I don’t know, and I wouldn’t want to be the one to test
>> it, either. :)
>>
>> I’m donating processor time with boinc and that’s good enough reason
>> to use the binary driver if it gives me more processor to donate.
>>
>> (Waiting before installing anything new is painful, I know, because
>> with Gentoo you always feel like you want it to be doing something, or
>> at least that’s my experience. :) )
>>
>
> I have no problem with you or anyone else running nouveau. None at all.
>
> I do have a problem with someone saying 'it's time for everyone to
> give up nvidia-drivers' without demonstrating they know the full
> impact of what they are suggesting. Had Cheng Renquan suggest 'Maybe
> people who don't need anything other than basic X capabilities should
> consider running nouveau' I wouldn't have even chimed in.
>
> And thanks for running boinc. It's good of you and good for you.
>
> Cheers,
> Mark
>
> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> skribis:
>> I do have a problem with someone saying 'it's time for everyone to
>> give up nvidia-drivers' without demonstrating they know the full
>> impact of what they are suggesting. Had Cheng Renquan suggest 'Maybe
>> people who don't need anything other than basic X capabilities should
>> consider running nouveau' I wouldn't have even chimed in.
>
> Sage Notebook (sage-on-gentoo overlay) can use CUDA as well. I think
> you don't have to worry that nvidia-drivers would go away; in the
> worst case it would end up in a good overlay. That's unlikely IMO, and
> would mostly likely be if there were an established alternative
> implementation of CUDA.
>
> On Mon, 19 Mar 2012 14:40:34 -0700
> Mark Knecht <markknecht@×××××.com> wrote:
>
>>
>> I have no problem with you or anyone else running nouveau. None at all.
>>
>> I do have a problem with someone saying 'it's time for everyone to
>> give up nvidia-drivers' without demonstrating they know the full
>> impact of what they are suggesting. Had Cheng Renquan suggest 'Maybe
>> people who don't need anything other than basic X capabilities should
>> consider running nouveau' I wouldn't have even chimed in.
>>
>
> I think the main complaint is that the Nvidia drivers are closed
> binary blobs while Nouveau is an attempt to create an entirely
> open source driver.  The spirit of free software demands that we
> support these open initiatives.
>
> Actually, until recently, I was very happy using the legacy open
> source xorg nvidia driver known simply as as "nv."  It is still
> available in Gentoo as x11-drivers/xf86-video-nv.
>
> Since I do not do gaming or other intensive graphic activities,
> I could get by nicely with just nv.  However, the nv driver does
> not seem to support the latest hardware too well.  On one of
> my machines I have a card based on Nvidia GeForce 210.  Although
> the nv driver works with this card, it does not enable the Xv
> extension and consequently the graphic response is poor.
>
> On older cards nv does work quite well for ordinary purposes.
>
> Frank Peters
>
>
> Frank Peters <frank.peters@×××××××.net> skribis:
>> I think the main complaint is that the Nvidia drivers are closed
>> binary blobs while Nouveau is an attempt to create an entirely
>> open source driver.
>
> Unfortunately the nvidia drivers are needed not only for graphics but
> also to use the GPU for scientific calculations, including for
> donating processor time to medical research, for instance.
>
>
> Frank Peters posted on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 00:03:06 -0400 as excerpted:
>
>> Actually, until recently, I was very happy using the legacy open source
>> xorg nvidia driver known simply as as "nv."  It is still available in
>> Gentoo as x11-drivers/xf86-video-nv.
>>
>> Since I do not do gaming or other intensive graphic activities, I could
>> get by nicely with just nv.  However, the nv driver does not seem to
>> support the latest hardware too well.
>
> FWIW, the old nv driver is legacy, now, and won't be supporting new
> hardware.  AFAIK older hardware should be switching as well, for support
> with current software, as nv won't be updated for that any longer, either.
>
> The same thing happened to it as happened to nvidia's proprietary network
> driver some years ago; pretty much everyone involved, including the
> distros that used to ship nv and nvidia itself, seems to have recognized
> that the reverse-engineered work is now better than nvidia's basic
> freedomware stub driver, nv, and nouveau has officially taken its place.
>
> --
> Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
> "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
> and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman
>
>
> Barry Schwartz posted on Tue, 20 Mar 2012 01:20:13 -0500 as excerpted:
>
>> Unfortunately the nvidia drivers are needed not only for graphics but
>> also to use the GPU for scientific calculations, including for donating
>> processor time to medical research, for instance.
>
> My donation ends where their disrespect for human freedom begins.  (Over
> a decade ago, back on MS, I used to run distributed.net.  However, they
> don't have a freedomware client, or at least didn't back then, and while
> I understand the reasons why -- someone cheating and saying they did the
> work when they didn't, just to get the stats -- that didn't change the
> fact that I wasn't going to run servantware.  But as they say, YMMV.)
>
> --
> Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
> "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
> and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman
>
>