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There's a lot of good stuff to think about here. For what it's worth, |
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some initial comments. |
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|
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On Wed, 2009-07-01 at 19:33 -0700, Ned Ludd wrote: |
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> The dev population is quite a strange beast. I never expected to win. |
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> Why would you vote for somebody who did not even publish a manifesto? |
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> I don't know but I love you for it. My only intention was to help offset |
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> dev-zero being able force the will of outside forces upon us. |
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> Well that has been accomplished for now (w00t). But I |
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> never ever expected to be ranked so high. "/me blushes" So that means you |
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> guys/gals expect stuff from me. Well as I never wrote a manifesto but |
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> you still voted for me, I guess I should share some of my ideas on what |
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> I'd like to see happen over the following year. |
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> |
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> The devs have a voice one time of the year: when it comes time to vote. |
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> But what about the rest of the year? What happens when the person you |
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> voted for sucks? You are mostly powerless to do anything other than be |
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> really vocal in what seems like a never ending battle. That needs to |
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> change. I'm not quite sure how. But I'd like to see the dev body have a |
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> year-round voice in the council. Either via quick votes year-round |
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> on topics or simply by having discussion in the channel. Devs should have |
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> a right to voice their concerns to the council and engage in interactive |
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> conversations without being labeled troll. |
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> |
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|
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We could provide for a recall vote, but I don't like that idea. |
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Discussion in channel is ideal if there is some way/someone to help keep |
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it civil enough to be useful. |
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|
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> Another one of the things I'd like to see and help reform with the |
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> council. First off it spends way too much time on EAPI/PMS. There is no |
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> reason to make the council an extension of the portage team. Portage is |
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> still the official package manager of Gentoo. Granted it's good to |
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> accommodate others to an extent and I've always kept an open mind on other tools. |
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> Alternatives are good as there is always the right tool for the task at hand. But |
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> the council really should not be getting involved most of the time unless there |
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> is a conflict which can't be worked out among the masses and those trying to get |
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> portage to adopt new features. If the dev body wants it otherwise then |
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> I'd like to turn my vote over to you the devs. Each and every time the |
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> council wants/has to vote on an EAPI/PMS feature then I'll happily put my |
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> vote in your hands. You fire up that old votify system and use my vote |
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> as yours. |
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|
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Not a bad idea if votify is agile enough. |
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|
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> Note however that zmedico is not in favor of his time being |
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> wasted on deciding what PMS/EAPI features are good. He simply likes bugs |
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> and solving those. He likes giving us new features and tends to be more in |
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> favor of the devs and community figuring out what is best for us. |
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> An EAPI review committee could work well also. As long as we could get |
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> non bias people in there. |
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> |
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EAPI review committee --- please do. I agree that council meetings are |
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not the place to do detail EAPI work. |
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|
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> The council should be more about community vs technical issues only. |
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> We have lots of top level projects within Gentoo which have simply given |
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> up on the council as being an outlet to accomplish anything useful. |
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> It should be our job to look at the projects in Gentoo. Look at the ones |
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> that have a healthy community and encourage and promote them in ways. |
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> |
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Agreed. |
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|
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> For example prefix comes to mind. It was a project I did not like at |
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> first. I'm not even a user. And there are things I surely don't like |
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> about it as is. But there is community support and it's the icing on the |
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> cake for some. So I'll back the fsck up and give credit where it's due. |
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> This is a perfectly good example of a project/fork that needs to come |
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> back home. Perhaps it's time to cherry pick some more stuff/people out |
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> of Sunrise? |
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> |
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> desultory points out any two council members can decide to approve anything, |
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> and that decision is considered to be equivalent to a full council vote |
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> until the next meeting. I vaguely recall that rule. I'm not sure about you, |
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> but I think that is a little to much power to put in the hands of a few. |
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> Any dev mind if we dump that power? |
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> |
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Dump it. |
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|
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> Meetings will likely go back to one time per month and be +m with +v be |
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> handed out per request with open chat pre/post meetings. The reason for |
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> this is to keep the meetings on-track. I won't engage in endless |
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> discussions. Facts can be presented. They will be reviewed on merit, |
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> technical and social. |
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> |
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Probably a good idea. I don't much care for biweekly free-for-alls |
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either. |
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|
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> The reason the meetings should go back to monthly is to allow those who |
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> are council members in Gentoo to accomplish things other than the |
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> council only. We all have personal lives and we all have our respective |
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> roles we play outside of the council. Another note on meetings. The time |
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> they are held currently don't fit well with my work schedule. |
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> |
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> I'm not subscribed directly to the gentoo-dev mailing list anymore |
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> outside of post-only. And I don't plan to re-subscribe. I do browse |
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> the archives regularly however. If there is some topic that should |
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> be brought to my attention please point it out to me directly on irc |
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> or CC: me. |
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> |
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> Thank you all and I will try not to let you down. Unless you were one of |
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> the ones who wanted to me lose. Then sorry, but I'm going to have fun |
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> disappointing you, by doing what is best for Gentoo. |
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> |
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> If you have any ideas on how you think the council should function or |
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> reform itself. Please start a new thread or email those who think will |
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> listen to those ideas. I'm open for some real change as long as it's |
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> for the the positive. |
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> |
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Thank you. |
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|
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> So lets have some damn fun again !@#$ |
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> Thanks. |
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> |
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> |
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Regards, |
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Ferris |
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-- |
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Ferris McCormick (P44646, MI) <fmccor@g.o> |
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Developer, Gentoo Linux (Sparc, Userrel, Trustees) |