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AllenJB wrote: |
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> The existing docs team may know GuideXML well, but it seems to me that |
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> the existing docs team isn't sufficient and needs some new blood that it |
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> currently isn't getting. 2008.0 has been deprecated for months, |
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> autobuilds have been out for months, eselect profile is now available |
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> for profile selection and yet the handbooks haven't been updated at all |
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> (they even still mention the GRP, which iirc was never released for 2008.0!) |
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|
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I dunno if new blood is needed . . . we have perfectly capable folks in |
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the docs team. They've been around for a few (or more) years, and |
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they've invested the time and trouble to write perfect GuideXML. The |
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problem is getting them up *off* their asses to do the work. |
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|
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> How many of the existing docs team have never worked with mediawiki (or |
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> another wiki - I'm using mediawiki as an example because I suspect it's |
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> the most likely choice)? |
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|
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I sure don't know how the hell it works. I've half-heartedly poked at |
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Wikipedia and the old gentoo-wiki when trying to fix really egregious |
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errors, but it's still nigh-uncomprehensible. |
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|
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> Following the documented instructions, you have to check out a large cvs |
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> tree, which takes some time and disk space, set up gorg (which in my |
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> opinion isn't very well documented) and possibly a web server (I think |
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> gorg may be able to run standalone, but I don't know how well it works |
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> and I could be wrong). Then you have to learn GuideXML. Then you have to |
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> learn how the handbook files are structured. Only then might a newbie to |
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> Gentoo documentation editing be able to actually start editing some docs. |
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|
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On an unoptimized ReiserFS v3 layout, ~/cvs/gentoo/xml takes up 281MB. |
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More than 82MB of that is images. |
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|
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I've never needed to compile and install gorg. In fact, I've refused to, |
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since I don't want to install a webserver just to work with docs, and I |
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don't want the bloat of Ruby for the same reason. I just use gvim and |
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nano. To each their own. |
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|
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Also, we *do* have good documents for writing GuideXML, and we even tell |
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users how to look at the code for our existing docs to get a feel for |
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them. Heck, just the other day, someone I've never run into before |
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turned in an almost flawless new document to bugzilla. |
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http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=275816 |
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|
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None of us helped him with his GuideXML as far as I know. This one came |
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out of the blue -- and it's a pretty damned fantastic doc. Users *are* |
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more capable than either of us typically give them credit. :) |
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|
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> As stated before, I believe many are already familiar with mediawiki |
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> syntax due to its already extensive use in open source documentation and |
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> it's extremely well documented and easy to learn, with lots of support |
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> already available. |
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|
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I don't know who these many others are, but I know the docs team doesn't |
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know the syntax. I, myself, find any and all wiki syntax completely |
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illegible and very difficult to parse. |
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|
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As the most (only?) active member of the GDP, I can tell you that I'd |
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probably quit if we switched to a wiki right now. |
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|
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It's too much upheaval to try to switch everything over to a wiki. We'd |
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need all hands on deck for several months just to get our existing |
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content base over, and that doesn't take into account the continual |
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influx of new bugs, updates, and whatnot that would roll in during that |
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time. Trying to do all that with just one person . . . not gonna happen. |
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|
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> I realize that there's work for infra involved in installing and |
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> maintaining a wiki. I realized that there's possibly work for some of |
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> the docs team in learning a new system and in initially porting |
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> documentation over (but some of this porting work may be offset by |
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> people like me who already know mediawiki well who would be willing to |
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> lend a hand in this task). However, I believe that in the long term, the |
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> benefits will easily outweigh these issues. |
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|
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Wikis are huge security risks, which is why historically infra has never |
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wanted to run a public wiki. In the previous (recent) three discussions |
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of the idea of an "official" sanctioned wiki, infra has told the GDP on |
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the MLs and on IRC that they are reluctant to run a public wiki because |
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of the security risks. |