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On Tue, Jul 06, 2021 at 06:12:42PM -0700, Matt Turner wrote: |
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> On Tue, Jul 6, 2021 at 3:27 PM Aaron Bauman <bman@g.o> wrote: |
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> > |
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> > On Tue, Jul 06, 2021 at 02:57:38PM -0700, Matt Turner wrote: |
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> > > On Tue, Jul 6, 2021 at 2:32 PM Micha?? Górny <mgorny@g.o> wrote: |
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|
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<snip> |
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|
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> In fact you didn't, and that is not the perception I was left with |
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> from our conversation. I suggest that you reread our conversation, |
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> because I don't think you have an accurate memory of it. |
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> |
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> 18:25 <@ mattst88> | I'm also disappointed that some Trustees that |
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> were elected on a platform of merging the Foundation into an |
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> umbrella... don't seem to have done anything towards that goal |
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> 18:25 <FreedomBear> | mattst88: It is a long process... |
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> 18:25 <FreedomBear> | mattst88: of course, I think some opinions have changed :) |
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> 18:26 <@ mattst88> | It is, but I see mgorny (not a Trustee) |
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> reaching out to umbrella orgs, not Trustees |
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> 18:26 <FreedomBear> | mattst88: he requested to do so and it was |
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> approved by the trustees. |
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> 18:26 <@ mattst88> | I think he took the initiative because it |
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> wasn't happening otherwise |
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> 18:26 <@FreedomBear> | Fair enough. |
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> |
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|
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There was much more to the conversation than just this. Please don't |
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pick and choose what you present. |
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|
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> Obviously the financial work Robin has done is valuable and necessary |
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> if we're to merge into an umbrella organization. I was not referring |
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> to him when I wrote the first line in that snippet. |
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> |
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|
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The entire year was focused on righting taxes. This was clearly |
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communicated through several bugs, emails (from the Foundation |
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president), #gentoo-trustees, and -nfp mails. There are some emails |
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which go to trustees@ but these are not public and are communications |
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with the tax people. |
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|
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> At no point in the conversation did you give an HTTP link. You said |
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> basically: it's on the Wiki and Bugzilla. Before today, there were |
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> only two minor edits to |
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> https://wiki.gentoo.org/index.php?title=Foundation:FoundationFutureState |
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> since September 2020. Is that an accurate picture of the Trustees' |
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> progress? I have no idea. |
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> |
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|
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It is all out there. Go look for it... or ask for a specific link. I did |
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ask what else could be done to smooth communication. If asked, I would |
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have provided a direct link. |
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|
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> There are no non-trivial changes to |
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> https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Foundation:Main_Page this year. The |
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> https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Foundation:Main_Page#Board_Minutes |
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> section ends in 2018 with no explanation as to why. |
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> |
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> The Foundation:Main_Page doesn't even have an accurate "Last elected" |
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> date for the President. |
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> |
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|
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I think this is accurate as he has served consecutive terms. |
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> I'm unsure what you find disagreeable about what I said? |
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> |
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|
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It is the manner in which you do it. You throw stones instead of asking |
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questions or requesting information. If you care enough... ask. I was |
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more than willing to support with my broad offer and request to |
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facilitate better communications as seen on IRC. |
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|
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> On IRC I asked how I could follow what the Trustees do, and you said: |
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> |
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> 18:32 <@ mattst88> | right. I meant, is there evidence of activity? |
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> presumably I can't just add myself to the trustees@ alias, so if I |
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> wanted to follow along I should... watch bugzilla? |
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> 18:33 <FreedomBear> | mattst88: bugzilla for sure. Wiki has the |
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> account information. |
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> |
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> But I'm not sure if Bugzilla contains everything. Presumably not. For |
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> example, it seems that a Trustee contacted the Linux Foundation in |
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> February and March [1]. I only learned about that because I saw |
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> robbat2 ask alicef in #gentoo-dev to summarize it for the Wiki. Robin |
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> added a bunch of information to that page today, and that's great, but |
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> probably insufficient as a general strategy for keeping Foundation |
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> members informed. |
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> |
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|
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So, you would like a better flow of information. That is fair and should |
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be addressed. |
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|
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> > Yet, here you are publically tossing out false information based on |
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> > your imperfect perception. |
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> |
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> It's probably not a great strategy to scold people for not knowing |
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> what you know, when you're failing to document what you know... |
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> |
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|
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See above. |
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|
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> Anway, I'm not sure what's false about my statement, but this is kind |
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> of my point precisely! |
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> |
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> I don't know what the Trustees do. I don't mean in general; I know you |
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> approve funds, etc. But like, what things have you actually done in |
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> the last $timeframe? |
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> |
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|
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Do you have some specific question? Do you think we should be doing |
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other things than what we are tasked with as a Foundation? Do you have a |
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recommendation? |
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|
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> The Council has monthly meetings with logs and summaries. Trustees |
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> have one annual meeting. Obviously the Trustees do things between |
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> annual meetings. How can anyone stay informed? |
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> |
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|
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This is understandable, they have a need for such things as day-to-day |
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project requirements drive such meeting frequency. |
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|
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Do you think the trustees should meet monthly? We have done this before, |
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but it was not very productive as most tasks, outside of approving |
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funds, are longer term. |
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> Maybe you could just clearly state what you've done towards the goal |
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> of merging the Foundation into an umbrella org? (I thought that at |
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> least at one point you were against that, so I'm not even completely |
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> sure of your position!) Maybe you're all working tirelessly to this |
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> end, but if you are, I'm almost completely unaware of it, and I don't |
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> think that's for lack of attention on my part. |
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> |
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|
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I have not done anything to assist in dissolving the Foundation as a |
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trustee. I don't agree that an umbrella is right for Gentoo. We can |
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discuss this further on another thread on -nfp if you like. I, |
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personally, have stated this across many mediums. |
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|
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The dissolution of the Foundation is what Alec proposed in his trustee |
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manifesto. |
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Aside from this, one critical factor of doing so (as you have noted) is |
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correcting the taxes which has been completed. This too was communicated |
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in official letters to -nfp and "President Updates". |
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|
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-Aaron |