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To: gentoo-nfp <gentoo-nfp@g.o>
From: "William L. Thomson Jr." <wltjr@g.o>
Subject: Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
Date: Thu, 22 May 2008 23:06:22 -0400
On Thu, 2008-05-22 at 22:34 -0400, Mark Loeser wrote:
>
> Have any requests for a FreeBSD box occurred? 

Not formally. But if that request gets honored. I would have to spend
more time doing something I am not interested in.

>  Would this actually help development?

Because back in January I started to move from dev-java/serlvetapi to
java-virtuals/servlet-api.
http://overlays.gentoo.org/proj/java/wiki/ServletApiToVirtualPackages

Which I have been effectively stalled. Due to some packages being
keyword for BSD, and others not.

http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=205082
http://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=214768

>   Is the problem with getting development done a lack of
> people, and not a lack of hardware?

This is preventing progress for months. I filed a bug, then later one
tried to request it directly to the two remaining doing anything BSD.
One of the direct contacts had some humor in it, and the other party
reacted to that. Then did nothing to address bug, or my issue.

>   I'm rather confident its the former rather than the latter.

What ever way you feel it is.

> You seem very focused on paying for all of the hardware, people's time
> is much more expensive.

If you look in archives. I had past thought of people being paid. Others
objected, so much that I have completely dropped that. I am not going to
waste anymore time looking into possibly paying others to do Gentoo
develop. When the others I was looking to have paid first, provided
allot of resistance.

I can spend my time finding ways to get myself paid through my own
company. Not people contributing their lives to Gentoo, and trying to
get them compensated there.


> Well, I think the way you have presented in this thread is really silly.

Ok so you don't like my idea or how I presented it.

> Effectively you are saying we will have people pay to become a member of
> the foundation so they can "vote".

Who is we? If we is a person or individual, then no $. I was very clear
on that. If we is a business, say AMD, Sun, etc. Then they pay and
appoint a representative. Who can't be an individual member.

I can't state that any clear. Business who could make $ off Gentoo pay
to be a member. People don't.

>   I have never seen a foundation vote
> for some "feature" or anything else occur, and it really will amount to
> nothing since features and other requests should go through the council.

What strategic relationships does Gentoo have with any vendors. To get
Gentoo certified on that hardware, tested etc. Some gear has come our
way in the past. But no strategic relationships like other distros have.

Which includes BSD wrt to Java.

> If something actual has technical merit, it will get recognized by
> someone.

And if not technical?


> You obviously haven't worked in any sort of company or group.

Yes, and you know me so well. No I am not part of the steering committee
for the Florida Linux Show. No I have never worked for big businesses,
attended RBCs, etc.

> Addressing concerns of those in a group is a major part of leading any
> initiative.  Get used to it.

As long as the concerns hold some merit. Also as long as those with the
concerns are willing like I. Do do something they don't want to, just to
see that it get's done. I would rather not be a trustee. I am only one
to see things get done that weren't.

> Have you considered that some of don't consider these to be
> improvements?

So nothing is better right? Like the saying goes, Do Something, lead
follow or get out of the way.


> 
> Any open source project could be crippled by the loss of a sponsor.

Not FreeBSD with their $400k. Or the Gnome Foundation with their paid
member model.

http://www.freebsdfoundation.org/documents/2008%20Q1%20Profit%20Loss.pdf
http://foundation.gnome.org/about/

Advisory board member companies pay an annual fee which helps finance
the operations of the GNOME foundation. There are two levels for
commerical companies. 

      * Small company: 1-49 employees. $5,000 / year
      * Medium and large company: 50 or more employees. $10,000 / year

> This is the nature of a community supported open source project.

No this is the nature of small projects. I have provided two examples
above. There are more out there.

>   Maybe if we were Fedora this wouldn't be a problem, but I like that we are
> do not have corporate backing, and I hope we stay this way.

That is my intentions. For Gentoo to have it's own funding as a NPO. To
never be reliant anyone sponsor, donor, person, corporation, etc.

To answer to know one but the cause that is Gentoo's mission. Putting
out the best OS in the world.

-- 
William L. Thomson Jr.
amd64/Java/Trustees
Gentoo Foundation

Attachment:
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References:
Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- William L. Thomson Jr.
RE: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- Chrissy Fullam
RE: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- William L. Thomson Jr.
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- Luca Barbato
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- William L. Thomson Jr.
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- Luca Barbato
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- William L. Thomson Jr.
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- Mark Loeser
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- William L. Thomson Jr.
Re: Section 4.1 Member Classes
-- Mark Loeser
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Updated Jun 17, 2009

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