1 |
William L. Thomson Jr. wrote: |
2 |
> On Thu, 2008-05-22 at 10:36 -0700, Chrissy Fullam wrote: |
3 |
>> How would Gentoo benefit from having non-developers (individuals as you put |
4 |
>> it) and businesses (you don't mention sponsors so I presume any business, |
5 |
>> say Intel) be allowed to become part of the foundation and have a vote? |
6 |
> |
7 |
> By allowing the greater community to feel they are participating and |
8 |
> have a role in Gentoo. Not limiting the Gentoo community to just |
9 |
> developers. |
10 |
|
11 |
Why not? |
12 |
|
13 |
> Also everything I have been reading in posts, and hearing in like |
14 |
> interviews. Which includes Vapier/Spanky's recent interview. Pretty much |
15 |
> calls for help from the community beyond development stuff. So those |
16 |
> people should have some form of representation. |
17 |
|
18 |
Right now the major issue I see within gentoo, past the rudeness that |
19 |
result in removal of poisonous people, is the will to do something ELSE |
20 |
than our core values: experiment, enjoy the results, have fun. |
21 |
|
22 |
> Unless you or others feel we should ignore the community. |
23 |
|
24 |
Which community? |
25 |
|
26 |
> And only reflect the will of the community through developers and |
27 |
> the council. |
28 |
|
29 |
I do not see any problem with that. Who does, decides his own fate. |
30 |
|
31 |
> Just to play out a scenario real quick for those concerned with power. |
32 |
> The community would like to see A. The foundation hears that, and goes |
33 |
> to the council and says hey. There is lots of interest in A. What are |
34 |
> the chances of it happening? Council makes a call/ruling, and that's |
35 |
> that. |
36 |
|
37 |
Bogus. |
38 |
|
39 |
People would like to see A, developers found A interesting, discussion |
40 |
happens among them, A gets done or not depending on the consensus |
41 |
|
42 |
The council got involved only IFF the consensus hadn't been reached. The |
43 |
foundation has NOTHING to do with this. |
44 |
|
45 |
> If the community is unhappy, sorry we can't please all. But at least |
46 |
> this way they have some influence, can participate in some way, and at |
47 |
> least are heard. |
48 |
|
49 |
Gentoo is a volunteer project, your value/honor/weight is given by your |
50 |
contribution to the project, that doesn't mean that non-developers have |
51 |
no chance to give an input, that just means that they have to convince |
52 |
others that their idea has a value. Everybody is free to participate by |
53 |
proposing on the gentoo-dev mailing list, contacting developers working |
54 |
on the area they are interested in, helping project and subprojects |
55 |
within Gentoo evolving. |
56 |
|
57 |
>> Also you mention Gentoo making money off this arrangement, can you please |
58 |
>> elaborate how the money comes into play? Where does it come from, how do we |
59 |
>> determine how much, and what do we do with it, etc? |
60 |
> |
61 |
> Money would come from businesses wishing to be members. Not from |
62 |
> individuals. The amount is yet to be discussed, and I am open there. But |
63 |
> I do feel a tiered system is based. Where the amount does change based |
64 |
> on company size. |
65 |
|
66 |
We got already sponsors, how that would change the relations we have |
67 |
with them? Again being a volunteer project the main contribution should |
68 |
be made in time and people. A business should hire developers or provide |
69 |
people willing to develop for Gentoo. Money by itself is less |
70 |
interesting and useful. |
71 |
|
72 |
> I think it's unfair to require a large corporation to pay the same |
73 |
> amount to be a member as a small to medium sized business. Maybe it's |
74 |
> unfair to have a tiered system where they pay different amounts. Not |
75 |
> sure. Up to debate, discussion, and majority there. |
76 |
|
77 |
I think that's unfair thinking about this. |
78 |
|
79 |
> As a business would have a benefit of using Gentoo. In some form, that |
80 |
> one would assume is reflected on their bottom line, profit wise. I feel |
81 |
> they should give back to the community. While that is optional now. If |
82 |
> they want to participate in some form beyond just contributing $. Then |
83 |
> they should be required to pay for such privileges. Essentially paying |
84 |
> for a membership, and right to vote. |
85 |
|
86 |
They should get their right to vote by doing not buying. |
87 |
|
88 |
> ( This would never apply to individuals, which would be free to join, |
89 |
> short of filling out an application/form, maybe a quiz, etc. ) |
90 |
|
91 |
Business last time I checked is done by individuals. |
92 |
|
93 |
> Now we are talking about a very small amount of influence if any at all. |
94 |
|
95 |
Considering what you suggested in another thread and on irc, it looks |
96 |
quite a large amount once the foundation got some of the power the |
97 |
council is supposed to have. |
98 |
|
99 |
> Being as how the foundation does not steer or control the project. The |
100 |
> council does. |
101 |
|
102 |
But strangely you are the same person asking for more power to the trustee. |
103 |
|
104 |
> It's mostly like a honorary thing. They could use it in |
105 |
> marketing etc. Our company supports and is a member of the Gentoo |
106 |
> Foundation, etc. Which could mean squat, but then again 99% of all |
107 |
> marketing is just hype so :) |
108 |
|
109 |
We got sponsors and again they are volunteers. |
110 |
|
111 |
Looks like the keyword here is "volunteering". |
112 |
|
113 |
lu |
114 |
|
115 |
-- |
116 |
|
117 |
Luca Barbato |
118 |
Gentoo Council Member |
119 |
Gentoo/linux Gentoo/PPC |
120 |
http://dev.gentoo.org/~lu_zero |
121 |
|
122 |
-- |
123 |
gentoo-nfp@l.g.o mailing list |