Gentoo Archives: gentoo-project

From: Rich Freeman <rich0@g.o>
To: gentoo-project@l.g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Should DevRel members be in Council?
Date: Mon, 15 Aug 2011 02:47:24
Message-Id: CAGfcS_k-k-SrXpc8WVo01Wasoq1aSZkiA5aEJHR_4Smqyjg75g@mail.gmail.com
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-project] Should DevRel members be in Council? by Samuli Suominen
1 On Sun, Aug 14, 2011 at 10:19 PM, Samuli Suominen <ssuominen@g.o> wrote:
2 > in developer relation bugs, the accused should also be allowed to recuse
3 > such double members; as
4 >
5 > "i'm not saying this as devrel member but..."
6 > "i'm not saying this as council member but..."
7 >
8 > is constantly being used as weapon by selected people, making the whole
9 > process of devrel unfair when other members get semi ignored
10
11 I don't think the accused should have any such rights. I do think
12 they (or their accusers) should have a right to a speedy appeal after
13 any disciplinary actions are imposed or denied. Then whatever the
14 decision of the Council is, the will of the Gentoo Developer Community
15 has been done. That's why we elect them.
16
17 Now, if people are somehow being denied an appeal then that is a
18 different matter.
19
20 Is your concern that non-council members of devrel feel like they have
21 less say, since the decision can be appealed to council and so they're
22 forced to more-or-less go along with what they feel the council will
23 want? If so, then I'd say the system is working as intended. When a
24 district judge is making a ruling, the first thing he does is sees
25 what higher courts have ruled in the past. It is a waste of
26 everybody's time for a judge to come up with a ruling that he knows
27 will be reversed. The only reason we have lower courts is that it
28 doesn't scale well to have every dispute heard by the highest court of
29 the land. It is much the same with the Council. If the Council
30 thinks that a certain devrel stance will improve the distro, then it
31 is their place to make that request and enforce it via appeals if
32 necessary.
33
34 Face it, Gentoo is a pretty easy place to get something done as long
35 as it doesn't involve stepping on everybody else's toes. Actually,
36 most teams are good about cooperating - if I got pinged that one of my
37 packages didn't work with the latest libfoo stable candidate I'd be
38 sure to take a look at it, and treecleaners would step in if I didn't
39 after a reasonable time. The only time we really need the Council is
40 for the big decisions. And, those big decisions don't get made more
41 effectively if everybody is questioning the right of anybody to make
42 the big decisions.
43
44 In the end, SOMEBODY has to make the last call. We might as well make
45 it an elected body.
46
47 Rich