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Sabayon is considered 'close' to Gentoo, but not necessarily 'very |
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close' (atleast in my view). The reason for this is because Sabayon uses |
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its own versions of some pretty major packages (browsing through their |
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overlay, I see packages like grub, xorg-x11 and xorg-server to name just |
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a few). |
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|
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The problem is not that we (the Gentoo community) don't want to provide |
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official support, it's that we can't (beyond a certain point). Sabayon |
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provides its own version of many packages and these seem to (sometimes) |
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lag behind the official Gentoo tree. A case in example: The other day |
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someone came into #gentoo complaining that nvidia-drivers wouldn't |
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install with glibc-2.6. Glibc-2.6 no longer includes the nptl and |
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nptl-only USE flags, but the Sabayon package was still looking for them. |
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There's nothing the Gentoo developers can do about this - it would |
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require commit access to Sabayon's overlay. There's nothing much most |
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users can do about this - The only suggestion I could make was "ask in |
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#sabayon or use the package from the official tree". |
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|
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This is a simple, obvious example of a change that caused problems. |
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There could easily be many much more subtle problems that break systems |
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in a much more subtle way. Most people in #gentoo will happily provide |
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support for Sabayon users, but if it becomes suspect that the problem |
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lies in using Sabayons packages, then there's frankly nothing we can do |
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as we don't know how Sabayon's packages differ, with most of us being |
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Gentoo users, not Sabayon users. |
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|
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As for providing official support on Bugzilla, a Sabayon users first |
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point of call must be the Sabayon developers (via their Bugzilla). If |
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the Sabayon developers then determine that the problem lies in Gentoo's |
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tree, they should report it to the Gentoo developers (via Gentoo's |
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Bugzilla). This is the same way things work with Gentoo vs upstream. |
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Users report bugs on Gentoo's Bugzilla, if the developers determine that |
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the problem lies with the program itself, the problem will then be |
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reported to the packages developers (AKA upstream). There's a hierarchy |
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of responsability here, the model of which is generally followed |
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throughout the open source world. (To take the hierarchy further, the |
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packages developers may determine that the problem lies with a library |
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that they use, in which case they may report the bug to the library's |
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developers (further upstream)). |
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|
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There are two seperate questions here, with seperate answers: |
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1) Can Gentoo's developers provide official support for Sabayon. The |
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answer is no - Sabayon users should report problems to Sabayon's |
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developers, who will then report the problem upstream if necessary. |
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2) Can Gentoo's community provide unofficial support for Sabayon. The |
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answer is yes - up until the problem is determined to be (possibly) |
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Sabayon specific - and it does. |
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|
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To translate this on to the Debian vs Ubuntu example: If an Ubuntu user |
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asks for help in #debian, they'll get it, but if the Debian community |
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determines the problem is possibly Ubuntu specific, they'll tell the |
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user to go back to the Ubuntu community as there's nothing they can do. |
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If an Ubuntu user reports a problem to Debians bugzilla, the Debian devs |
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will tell them to go talk to the Ubuntu devs because there's nothing |
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they can do - they have no influence over the Ubuntu packages. |
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|
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Beso: |
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Gentoo doesn't have kicker, an essential part of KDE in it's repository. |
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Right... This is exactly the problem... it does, and the differences may |
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cause bugs that manifest themselves outside of Kicker in subtle ways. |
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The Gentoo developers have looked at the differences between the |
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repositories, and they aren't closed minded, but they haven't got the |
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time to run through every problem from Sabayon users to determine |
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themselves if it's a problem with Gentoo or Sabayon. There is a chain of |
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responsability here and for Sabayon users it starts with the Sabayon |
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developers, just as with Ubuntu users it starts with the Ubuntu |
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developers. |
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|
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In summary: |
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|
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|
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|
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* Sabayon is NOT Gentoo. Sabayon is CLOSE TO Gentoo. |
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* The Gentoo community does provide unofficial support for Sabayon |
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users. |
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* Sabayon users should report problems to Sabayons developers, who |
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will then report the problem upstream (which may or may not be |
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the Gentoo developers) if necessary. |
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* If it's a Sabayon specific problem, then only people who know |
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Sabayon (ie. the Sabayon community) are going to be able to help |
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solve it. |
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|
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|
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|
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http://forums.gentoo.org/viewtopic-t-541789-postdays-0-postorder-asc-highlight-sabayon-start-100.html |
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|
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|
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|
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On Wed, 2007-08-01 at 21:22 -0700, René 'Necoro' Neumann wrote: |
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> -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- |
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> Hash: SHA1 |
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> |
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> Hey guys, |
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> |
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> I'd like to discuss a topic that I know much people will use for |
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> trolling/flaming or similar. If you feel like this - get you a weapon |
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> and cool down, but please do not answer :) |
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> |
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> I start this discussion as I'm inspired by some posts at drobbin's blog. |
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> |
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> The first thing: |
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> What is the actual (official) attitude towards Sabayon? |
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> |
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> If it is as I think it is (negative) - why is it like this? Why isn't |
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> Sabayon treated as an official "child project"? Why is support denied |
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> for Sabayon Users? - I know that they have a global ~$ARCH and some |
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> not-so-nice hacks ;), but this shouldn't be a reason, as problems |
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> related to this shouldn't be the major part... |
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> |
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> I want just to propose, that the devs should be more open for Sabayon - |
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> and see it as a source of ideas and software. If lxnay will finish |
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> Entropy (and it helds what it is supposed ;)) - it will add a feature |
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> that is often asked for and always declined as "not possible". (And |
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> there may be other stuff ...) |
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> |
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> |
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> Hmm ... I had several other thoughts but forgot them during the day :/. |
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> So again: Only serious, constructive answers :) |
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> |
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> - -- Nec |
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> |
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> P.S.: Nope - I'm not a Sabayon User :) |
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> |
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> iD8DBQFGsVwP4UOg/zhYFuARAgJ7AJ4ly6n/vGhKxFby7HpvFdNyEGw96ACdF6VV |
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> kHM9MZIKcpQrtDS6zb37IGs= |
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> =JwcP |
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