From mboxrd@z Thu Jan 1 00:00:00 1970 Return-Path: Received: from lists.gentoo.org (pigeon.gentoo.org [208.92.234.80]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by finch.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 69C52158042 for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2024 01:55:47 +0000 (UTC) Received: from pigeon.gentoo.org (localhost [127.0.0.1]) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with SMTP id 7FAA5E08A0; Sun, 27 Oct 2024 01:55:43 +0000 (UTC) Received: from smtp.gentoo.org (woodpecker.gentoo.org [140.211.166.183]) (using TLSv1.3 with cipher TLS_AES_256_GCM_SHA384 (256/256 bits) key-exchange X25519 server-signature RSA-PSS (4096 bits)) (No client certificate requested) by pigeon.gentoo.org (Postfix) with ESMTPS id 3D261E087B for ; Sun, 27 Oct 2024 01:55:43 +0000 (UTC) Message-ID: <96a5030d-fcc6-4a45-b669-45bbd9d83fb6@gentoo.org> Date: Sat, 26 Oct 2024 21:55:39 -0400 Precedence: bulk List-Post: List-Help: List-Unsubscribe: List-Subscribe: List-Id: Gentoo Linux mail X-BeenThere: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Reply-to: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org X-Auto-Response-Suppress: DR, RN, NRN, OOF, AutoReply MIME-Version: 1.0 User-Agent: Mozilla Thunderbird Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] [PATCH] profiles/thirdpartymirrors: add final fallback for apache To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org References: <20241023032429.1874420-1-eschwartz@gentoo.org> Content-Language: en-US From: Eli Schwartz Autocrypt: addr=eschwartz@gentoo.org; keydata= xjMEZmeRNBYJKwYBBAHaRw8BAQdAYNZ7pUDWhx1i2f3p6L2ZLu4FcY18UoeGC04Gq/khqwfN I0VsaSBTY2h3YXJ0eiA8ZXNjaHdhcnR6QGdlbnRvby5vcmc+wpYEExYKAD4WIQTvUdMIsc4j CIi+DYTqQj6ToWND8QUCZoRL+gIbAwUJBKKGAAULCQgHAwUVCgkICwUWAgMBAAIeBQIXgAAK CRDqQj6ToWND8aB5AP9r4kB691nNtNwKkdRiOdl7/k6WYzokvHvDamXxRJ0I+gEAjZqR5V8y mfR3fy2Z+r2Joeqdt3CIv5IwPs64spBvigLOOARmZ5E0EgorBgEEAZdVAQUBAQdATT46Z06b 1X9xjXFCYFxmq/Tj3tSEKZInDWTpoHQp4l8DAQgHwn4EGBYKACYWIQTvUdMIsc4jCIi+DYTq Qj6ToWND8QUCZmeRNAIbDAUJBKKGAAAKCRDqQj6ToWND8a2RAP40KPfbfoiZAJW5boFmFJ3G TUBDJRh9CWHyaPqq2PN+0wD/R07oLzfnJUN209mzi9TuTuHjeZybysyqXSw4MAxkMAY= In-Reply-To: Content-Type: multipart/signed; micalg=pgp-sha256; protocol="application/pgp-signature"; boundary="------------HlqCY2IoY20ktvECLerC5GPl" X-Archives-Salt: 8b49ae2e-2fa8-4228-b165-47d233f25d78 X-Archives-Hash: 98beea11990b063fc2810221486b8d5f This is an OpenPGP/MIME signed message (RFC 4880 and 3156) --------------HlqCY2IoY20ktvECLerC5GPl Content-Type: multipart/mixed; boundary="------------iLY3J0nKRO0dbgKAGxYgT97t"; protected-headers="v1" From: Eli Schwartz To: gentoo-dev@lists.gentoo.org Message-ID: <96a5030d-fcc6-4a45-b669-45bbd9d83fb6@gentoo.org> Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] [PATCH] profiles/thirdpartymirrors: add final fallback for apache References: <20241023032429.1874420-1-eschwartz@gentoo.org> In-Reply-To: --------------iLY3J0nKRO0dbgKAGxYgT97t Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable On 10/26/24 1:03 AM, Robin H. Johnson wrote: > This does not actually do it "last" as you claim. >=20 > Portage shuffles the list of thirdpartymirrors: > https://gitweb.gentoo.org/proj/portage.git/tree/lib/portage/package/ebu= ild/fetch.py#n1140 >=20 > While it increases mirror burden; this should likely be done as a > distinct thirdpartymirror: > apache-historical https://archive.apache.org/dist/ Thanks for pointing this out. It's disappointing but my opinion is that this changes nothing other than the commit message I should use when committing it. > And that gets used in ebuilds when distfiles fall off the main mirrors > [until such time as strictly ordered behavior is available]. This is an unreasonable and irrational burden on ebuild maintainers, and regardless of your choice of remediation, if it isn't automatically and transparently handling it via the thirdpartymirrors handling itself, nobody wins. Not ebuild maintainers (who have to both know the quirks of apache and watch more closely than usual for updates), not bug triagers (who run the risk of getting trivially solvable issues to sort through), and not users (who run a supported configuration and end up with availability issues). It's a bug (albeit low priority) if SRC_URI doesn't point to a valid download location -- why should the fact that thirdpartymirrors has no priority selection change that fact? The suggestion downthread about extending this somehow in EAPI 9 is clever -- we should do it, but we also shouldn't leave the current state of affairs broken until some unspecified time years in the future. > In likelihood, unless the ebuild has RESTRICT=3Dmirror, I'd hope that t= hat > the primary request is made to Gentoo's mirrors before the upstreams: s= o > that we are better open-source participants. Yes. This is why I think any change to thirdpartymirrors is low risk. > Users who are also trying to use old ebuilds, where the distfile is no > longer on the Gentoo mirrors should also consider thirdpartymirrors in > their profiles, in which case inserting this entry locally would be > appropriate. Unacceptable. This isn't about old ebuilds. It's about the very latest ebuilds. Distfiles go missing from the upstream CDN and are only available via long-term archival, the same minute (AFAIK, based on their documentation) that a new patchlevel release is tagged upstream. It is physically impossible for Gentoo to be that fast in packaging new versions, and it doesn't matter anyway because it won't help for another month due to stabilization. And that is assuming it gets packaged as fast as the maintainer can package it -- forgive me for being skeptical about that one, we are all human after all. :) It is reasonable, expected, normal use of computers, and reasonable, expected, normal use of Gentoo, to download and install "old" versions of a program minutes or hours after another patch release is out. We must not penalize those users by requiring them to manually implement this patch at global scope, running the risk that they will get it wrong and list only the slow site which they then overload for *all* traffic rather than at least having shuffle(). For indeed, overriding a mirror in /etc/portage/mirrors is just going to force that to be used first for ALL packages using mirror://apache/ at all. At least it respects your listed ordering I guess... --=20 Eli Schwartz --------------iLY3J0nKRO0dbgKAGxYgT97t-- --------------HlqCY2IoY20ktvECLerC5GPl Content-Type: application/pgp-signature; name="OpenPGP_signature.asc" Content-Description: OpenPGP digital signature Content-Disposition: attachment; filename="OpenPGP_signature.asc" -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- wnsEABYIACMWIQTnFNnmK0TPZHnXm3qEp9ErcA0vVwUCZx2dmwUDAAAAAAAKCRCEp9ErcA0vVwB5 AQDHa3m9VCIkN+dqdz4mAVvRoCA/KcXlPKi7h+ZF3jpZpAEAuEGBhS6yyXKmuap7s9SuwYmDvHq2 IelZWgJcRaGn6wk= =5fwT -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- --------------HlqCY2IoY20ktvECLerC5GPl--