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On Tue, Dec 29, 2015 at 8:58 AM, Kristian Fiskerstrand <k_f@g.o> wrote: |
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> |
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> On 12/28/2015 07:35 PM, Rich Freeman wrote: |
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>> On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 10:07 AM, Kristian Fiskerstrand |
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>> <k_f@g.o> wrote: |
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>>>> On 28 Dec 2015, at 15:58, James Le Cuirot <chewi@g.o> |
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>>>> wrote: |
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>>>> |
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> |
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> |
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>> That concern is hardly unique to phones. PCs suffer just as much |
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>> from this problem. The solution could potentially be the same. |
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>> For |
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> |
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> But here we already have smartcards (that everyone should and _is_ |
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> using... right?) |
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I imagine that smartcards have about as much support on mobile as they |
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do on PCs, which is to say not much. |
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Sure, you can make it work, but software support for signing stuff is |
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limited in general, let alone support for doing it with smartcards. |
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|
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> |
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>> signing it is a straightforward problem since there is nothing to |
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>> be kept secret except the key material itself (just send the |
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>> message to the signing device, and return the signature back). For |
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>> encryption |
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> |
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> for clarity (and what I think you already mean), the message in this |
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> case is the message to be signed (which is likely a blinded hash or |
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> something, so much shorter than the original data) |
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|
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If you don't display the plaintext on the device doing the signing, |
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then you're vulnerable to a MITM unless you trust your PC, but if you |
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trusted your PC you wouldn't need the signing device. |
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The only thing a smartcard does is protects the private key itself. |
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It doesn't protect you from manipulation of the data to be signed, or |
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theft of plaintext, etc. |
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|
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> |
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> Indeed, but at least the device won't be able to decrypt further |
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> communication as it'd only have access to the session key of the |
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> particular message. Loosing control of the private (sub)key is |
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> substantially worse, so that might actually be ok for the security |
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> parameters of the users. |
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I agree, there are degrees of failure. |
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> |
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> This already happen in several countries, including Germany and on a |
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> semi-related variant Norway (its government approved to sign |
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> electronically using BankID, where the banks does the verification). |
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> In germany there is even a CA that checks the government ID and |
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> certify OpenPGP keys based on it. |
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> |
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|
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That is at least a step up. Should we require or at least recommend |
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government-signed keys for Gentoo in the few jurisdictions that |
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provide them? I guess the main concern would be if we wanted to allow |
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anonymity. |
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|
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So many problems would be solved if a signature using a secure device |
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was required for every financial transaction. Just stick the PIN pad |
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on the signing device with a small display. The device is given a |
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message to sign including the date, amount to be authorized, and who |
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is getting paid. The device displays this info on its screen and |
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prompts for a PIN. For the problem of payment authorization that |
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would eliminate almost all forms of fraud that don't involve holding |
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somebody at gunpoint (and you could have a duress PIN and an encrypted |
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field in the authorization large enough to hold either a padded all |
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clear or an under-duress message with the timestamp and GPS |
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coordinates that only the bank could read). |
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|
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In the US everybody seems to be afraid of big brother but big brother |
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has enough big data that he doesn't really need you to use his fancy |
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signing device anyway. |
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-- |
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Rich |