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Hi Ryan, |
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|
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I hope you find these comments useful. |
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|
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On Fri, 2006-04-28 at 10:14 -0700, Ryan Phillips wrote: |
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> __Problem: Developer Growth__ |
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> |
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> Why do people have to take a test? |
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|
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There are certain skills we need a developer to demonstrate before we |
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can give them commit access. There is currently no opportunity for a |
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would-be-developer to demonstrate all of those skills before they get |
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commit access. |
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|
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This is where working in overlays has helped some groups. It gives |
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would-be-devs an opportunity to learn and develop the skills they would |
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need to become Gentoo developers. |
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|
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But I don't see overlays as a replacement for our tests ... they're only |
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a training ground to help get people ready to take the tests. |
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|
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The magic thing about Gentoo is that everything finds its own level. |
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That's our secret formula. If an area of working with Linux is |
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important enough to enough people, Gentoo becomes strong in that area, |
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and its weaknesses reflect where something simply isn't important enough |
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for people to make an effort. It's a beautiful thing when it works. |
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|
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It's also the thing that puts a lot of people off. Many people fear |
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uncertainty. They need to exist within a plan or some sort of structure |
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in order to be able to function. Our approach is uncertainty in motion. |
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Your only guarantee is what rsync delivered this morning. |
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|
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The master plan is simply to deliver what $UPSTREAM invents, as close to |
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what $UPSTREAM intended as possible. That's a different world to what |
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most people know, and it's a message we do a piss poor job of |
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communicating to anyone and everyone. |
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|
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> __Problem: Live Tree__ |
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> |
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> Having a live tree requires people to be perfect. People are not perfect and |
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> requiring it is ridiculous. I love having commits in my local tree within the |
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> hour, but having a stable and unstable branch makes a lot of sense. |
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|
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We have one live tree that is trying to be all things to all people. |
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It's a development tree (package.mask), it's a testing tree (~arch), |
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it's a production tree (one tree per arch). The tree isn't robust or |
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resilient - one mistake intended for the development tree can break the |
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other two trees. |
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|
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Splitting up the tree into two - development/testing & arch trees - |
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would be the sensible thing to do. The counter argument here is that |
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the arch trees would wither and die, because all the fun would be |
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happening in the other trees. I don't buy that for an instant. Simply |
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make the arch trees the default on the install media, and 80% of the |
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userbase will never even notice that the other tree even exists. |
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|
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> __Problem: CVS__ |
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> |
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> CVS is one of the worst application ever created. |
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|
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Hear, hear. |
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|
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I'd like to see a move to Subversion made a priority for 2006. If there |
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are problems with Subversion's performance with our tree, engage with |
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its authors to obtain improvements. But get it done. |
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|
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> __Problem: QA Policies__ |
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> |
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> http://article.gmane.org/gmane.linux.gentoo.devel/37544 |
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> |
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> It seems that the QA Policies are a product of a Live Tree, and going partially |
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> non-live would solve the problems listed. |
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|
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I can see the point, but I don't agree. |
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|
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Those behind that proposal mean well, but I personally feel that their |
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focus isn't where it will do the most good. The proposals that Mark has |
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posted on -dev are for a reactive, enforcement-first team that's focused |
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on applying coding standards across all our packages. A proactive, |
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education-led team that's focused on finding out what's actually hurting |
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our users will deliver more benefit to Gentoo in a shorter period of |
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time. Give a man a fish, and you feed him for a day. Teach him how to |
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fish, and you feed him for a lifetime. It's not hokum. |
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|
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> Conflict resolution should not be a subproject. It should *not* exist at all. |
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> Rules need to be in place to avoid conflict. Having some sort of voting |
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> structure for all the developers (this doesn't mean requiring everyone to vote) |
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> and not just the council or devrel makes a lot of sense for most things. If I |
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> don't like how someone is acting within the project there should be a vote and |
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> then see if that person is kicked out. No trial, no anything besides a vote. |
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> And if I lose I have to deal with it. Either stay with the project, or find |
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> something else. This solution just works. |
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|
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Man is a political animal, and this sort of voting structure I find too |
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simplistic and too naive. How does it cope with the malicious dev who |
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takes every opportunity to slander another one behind their back? If |
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you tell someone something often enough, people accept it as the truth - |
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even if it's a lie. And people are lazy. They'll take information from |
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someone they trust, and not take the trouble to learn whether or not |
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that information is true. That's why advertising works :) |
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|
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In any organisation, you have to have key people who understand what the |
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organisation is about, and who police it to get rid of those people who |
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from the inside are subverting and attacking the organisation's culture. |
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An organisation's culture is it's immune system - it's what keeps things |
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together when everything else is falling apart - and those who undermine |
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it are exceedingly dangerous to the organisation as a whole. |
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|
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In any walk of life, it's a sad but true fact that most of the staff in |
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most organisations do not "get" what the organisation is, and what its |
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culture is, to the extent that they can be trusted to preserve it |
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without assistance. Every one of us has a unique perspective on the |
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world, and no two of us have an identical perspective. |
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|
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> Gentoo should be a fun environment. The previous paragraph should be taken as |
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> a last resort. |
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|
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Gentoo should be a fun environment. I don't see how turning it into a |
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popularity contest brings back the fun. |
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|
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And I don't see how it benefits our users. |
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|
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> __Problem: GLEPs__ |
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> |
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> I dislike GLEPs. Usually they sit on the website for a long long time not |
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> doing anything. My vote (+1) is get rid of gleps and do everything by email |
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> and a vote by the developers. AFAIK, the board votes on the GLEPs. Bad Idea. |
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> It stifles things from getting done, and there is no ownership of who is going |
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> to implement the idea. |
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|
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How many of the changes that are covered by the 50 or so GLEPs that |
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exist today have been held up because of the GLEP process? How many of |
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them would have been delivered today under your proposals? |
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|
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I don't think that your argument will stand up to that analysis. |
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|
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I do agree that the GLEP process isn't working. Would we miss it? |
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|
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> __Problem: Voting__ |
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> |
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> Gentoo has over 200 developers. People are generally against the voting idea, |
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> but I'm not sure why. |
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|
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I've explained my personal reasons above. |
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|
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> The Apache Foundation has over 1300 developers; they must be doing something |
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> right. |
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|
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I don't see how the size of a workforce is a measurement of success, |
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unless you're a middle manager in a firm who needs an empire underneath |
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you to justify the existance of your own job. |
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|
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In fact, I'd go as far as saying that it's our growth that has become |
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our problem. Too often we've taken on people because we were grateful |
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for the extra pair of hands, and haven't taken the time to see whether - |
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technically and socially - they were right for Gentoo. |
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|
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But I don't feel that we're in any sort of crisis at the moment. We're |
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continuing to deliver packages to our users, who are continuing to use |
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what we produce. |
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|
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We're going through a patch where there are more disputes than some |
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people are comfortable with; but as long as all involved continue to |
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respect each other and to learn from each other, the individual issues |
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will get resolved. |
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|
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It's the breakdown in respect between people that's the real issue that |
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needs addressing. Too many of us only know each other from looking at |
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pixels on a screen. I think it's time we got off our collective rears, |
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and did our best to get all of us face to face at the same time. |
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|
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I'm offering to lead the effort to establish a global Gentoo developer |
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conference, and to do whatever it takes to get everything we need to |
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make this happen. Now who's up for this? :) |
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|
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Best regards, |
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Stu |
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-- |
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Stuart Herbert stuart@g.o |
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Gentoo Developer http://www.gentoo.org/ |
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http://blog.stuartherbert.com/ |
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|
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GnuGP key id# F9AFC57C available from http://pgp.mit.edu |
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Key fingerprint = 31FB 50D4 1F88 E227 F319 C549 0C2F 80BA F9AF C57C |
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-- |