Gentoo Archives: gentoo-dev

From: Duncan <1i5t5.duncan@×××.net>
To: gentoo-dev@l.g.o
Subject: [gentoo-dev] Re: Two-level portage tree is irrelevant.
Date: Mon, 24 Aug 2009 17:25:08
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-dev] Two-level portage tree is irrelevant. by Andrew D Kirch
1 Andrew D Kirch posted on Mon, 24 Aug 2009 12:14:56 -0400 as excerpted:
3 > Dmitry Grigoriev wrote:
4 >>
5 >>
6 >> The idea is that package tree physical structure must correspond to
7 >> logical structure. E.g. package kde/games/tactics-and-strategy/knetwalk
8 >> instead of kde-base/knetwalk, and kde/games/all instead of manually
9 >> managed meta-package or set @kde-games (kde/all == @kde,
10 >> kde/games/arcade/all == @kde-games-arcade, ...).
11 >>
12 > I don't see a problem with this per-se other than that the massive
13 > amount of re-organization which would be required, which could otherwise
14 > be spent on fixing bugs, adding enhancements, and other cool stuff. I
15 > think the price is too high in the manpower catagory.
17 General observation: In the FLOSS community it is often said (correctly)
18 that for something to be done, it normally must scratch an itch that
19 someone with the skills to do it has, an itch bad enough to motivate the
20 dedication of the necessary time and intellectual energy.
22 It's thus that there are all sorts of otherwise impractical little
23 projects going on, some to eventual usability, some to eventual full
24 maturity, some dying on the vine, as it were. It's the incredible
25 broadness of the community, and thus the incredible broadness of
26 selection of all those little projects, that continues to drive FLOSS,
27 generally far more broadly and effectively than it could ever be driven
28 in an unshared or charge-to-share primarily cost/payment driven
29 proprietary system.
31 You see this put to great effect in the firefox extensions setup.
32 There's dozens of browser choices, but really only one with the
33 extensibility of firefox, an extensibility that many users quickly find
34 indispensable, thus making firefox itself indispensable for those users.
36 The same applies to some Gentoo projects. Realistically, how many of
37 those exotic archs we support, if only in -prefix or experimental form,
38 would even exist at all, if they had to be cost and time justified? But
39 they are someone's hobby, Gentoo is a volunteer organization, and those
40 devs have volunteered to make their hobby yet another Gentoo project.
42 Thus we get to the point. I agree that it's not particularly practical
43 to think about how the Gentoo tree might be better organized if we were
44 to do it today. However, if someone with the skills and the drive to
45 make it so can be found, that either has that itch bad enough, or can be
46 /given/ that itch bad enough, to actually /make/ it so, well then, it's
47 likely to happen. Otherwise, no, it's not, as however nice it might be
48 in theory, there's always higher priority more effective ways for those
49 with the skills and the access to make it happen, to spend their time.
51 Thus, the OP's mission, should he choose to accept it, is to either
52 develop the skills and become a Gentoo developer himself, thus giving
53 himself access to do it, or to effectively enough spread that itch to
54 someone who has the skills and the access, thus giving them the
55 motivation necessary as well.
57 Otherwise, I agree, it's simply very unlikely to ever happen, because the
58 solution we have now is "good enough" and the cost of changing it and
59 taking care of all those loose ends to make it work is high enough, that
60 there are always better ways to spend that time and energy.
62 --
63 Duncan - List replies preferred. No HTML msgs.
64 "Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
65 and if you use the program, he is your master." Richard Stallman