[gentoo-dev] Re: gentoo-dev digest, Vol 1 #534 - 12 msgs

[Erik Mathisen]

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Sendt: 5. september 2002 19:01
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Emne: gentoo-dev digest, Vol 1 #534 - 12 msgs


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Today's Topics:

   1. questions about /var/run and pids (Dominik Westner)
   2. Re: Portage and /usr/local (Dominik Westner)
   3. Re: Portage and /usr/local (Marko Mikulicic)
   4. Re: Server / security thing (Evan Read)
   5. teTeX testing (Matthew J. Turk)
   6. Re: Portage and /usr/local (Sven Vermeulen)
   7. Installation via ISDN or Modem (Manuela Marquardt)
   8. Re: Portage and /usr/local (Eric Jacoboni)
   9. Re: Portage and /usr/local (Eric Jacoboni)
  10. Re: Installation via ISDN or Modem (drev@××××××.it)
  11. Re: questions about /var/run and pids (mike)
  12. Clearing the clutter (Thomas Osterlie)

--__--__--

Message: 1
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 08:52:28 +0200
From: Dominik Westner <lists@×××××××××××.com>
To: gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: [gentoo-dev] questions about /var/run and pids

Hi all,

when creating some ebuilds I quite often run into the following problem:

I have a daemon program which should run under a specific user.
Additionally I think a good daemon should always write their pid in
/var/run.

Problem: /var/run is only writable by root. Therefore only daemons
which run as root can put their pid into /var/run.

I think a better approach would be to have /var/run owned and being
writeable by group 'daemon'.
Every daemon program could then belong to the daemon group and write
its pid into /var/run.

Or do I simply miss something?

Dominik


--__--__--

Message: 2
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 08:58:47 +0200
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Portage and /usr/local
Cc: Eric Jacoboni <jaco@××××××××××××.org>, gentoo-dev@g.o
To: Marko Mikulicic <marko@××××.org>
From: Dominik Westner <westner@×××××××××××.com>


On Donnerstag, September 5, 2002, at 02:08 AM, Marko Mikulicic wrote:
>
> Why UNIX has the distinction between /,/usr ?
> I readed in the GNU Hurd documentation that it is just
> a tradition from the old tape times, althrough it is true that
> this separation eases the network sharing of binaries (/usr can be
> mounted readonly
> in remote clients).
>

Interesting I always thought that you can boot a system without /usr.
Anything which is necessary for system startup is located in /bin,
/sbin, /lib ...

Dominik


--__--__--

Message: 3
Date: Thu, 05 Sep 2002 09:36:58 +0200
From: Marko Mikulicic <marko@××××.org>
To: Dominik Westner <westner@×××××××××××.com>
Cc: Eric Jacoboni <jaco@××××××××××××.org>, gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Portage and /usr/local

Dominik Westner wrote:
>
> On Donnerstag, September 5, 2002, at 02:08 AM, Marko Mikulicic wrote:
>
>>
>> Why UNIX has the distinction between /,/usr ?
>> I readed in the GNU Hurd documentation that it is just
>> a tradition from the old tape times, althrough it is true that
>> this separation eases the network sharing of binaries (/usr can be
>> mounted readonly
>> in remote clients).
>>
>
> Interesting I always thought that you can boot a system without /usr.
> Anything which is necessary for system startup is located in /bin,
> /sbin, /lib ...
>
> Dominik

Personally, I would keep the dinstiction between / and /usr, as opposed
to what GNU Hurd Debian does. But only because of the boot process and
nfs root clients and the like. In /usr/local/ I would keep software
installed without
ebuild and in /opt binary packaged software (java, ...) as in FHS.

Marko


--__--__--

Message: 4
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 17:57:36 +1000 (EST)
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Server / security thing
From: "Evan Read" <eread@×××××××××.org>
To: <Mikko.Moilanen@×××××××××××××××××××.fi>
Cc: <gentoo-dev@g.o>

> Hi
>
> Would it be good idea to make additional cammand "emerge security" to
> check and upgrade any security things like now "emerge system" upgrades
> some standard system things?

Well, # emerge world should update everything you have to the latest, and
therefore security fixed, ebuilds.

To have emerge check for the security of a system would be a lot of work.
Better to use third party tools like nessus
(http://www.gentoo.org/packages/net-analyzer/nessus.html).

> This would definetly be good for people who maintain servers or for
> people who maintain workstations or this would just be *good* for
> people.

I think that having a "stable" set of packages which represents a released
version + fixes would be good for those people.  Managing security cant
be that automatic.

Thanks.

Evan.





--__--__--

Message: 5
From: "Matthew J. Turk" <satai@g.o>
To: gentoo-user <gentoo-user@g.o>,
	gentoo-dev <gentoo-dev@g.o>
Date: 05 Sep 2002 03:16:35 -0500
Subject: [gentoo-dev] teTeX testing


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Hi everyone - I've just version bumped (and masked) the latest pretest
from the teTeX people.  I'd really appreciate it if you could all test
it and make sure it meets your needs - run through some of your old
LaTeX/TeX source files, pdfTeX things, etc, just to make sure it's all
working properly.  If you could please send me an e-mail with your
results (satai@g.o), that'd be great -- and hopefully we can get
this unmasked very soon - and have a working pdfTeX for once!

Also - if you use Omega, could you let me know ASAP?  If so, I'll need
to include that, as it's been removed from the "official" teTeX
distribution.

Thanks!


mjt
--=20
Matthew J. Turk
satai@g.o

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Message: 6
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 11:05:18 +0200
From: Sven Vermeulen <sven.vermeulen@××××××.be>
To: gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Portage and /usr/local


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On Thu, Sep 05, 2002 at 08:58:47AM +0200, Dominik Westner wrote:
> Interesting I always thought that you can boot a system without /usr.=20
> Anything which is necessary for system startup is located in /bin,=20
> /sbin, /lib ...

/bin, /sbin, /lib etc... are the files necessary to boot the system and to =
be
able to mount /usr (seperate partition or even NFS-exported).=20

/usr/bin, /usr/sbin, /usr/lib, /use/share etc... are the rest of the files,
provided by the distribution. This can be NFS-exported as happens frequently
on large networks where the boxes are merely intended for command-line usage
(but also "bigger" usage is possible, ofcourse).

/usr/local consist of the files that are compiled *on that box*, not by usi=
ng
any distribution-provided packagingtool (that's why all the tarballs you'll
find install themselves in /usr/local by default).

/opt is, as mentioned by another poster (sry, I've forgotten your name), mo=
st
of the time used for binary installs, such as the LSB-rpms.

This is how I've learned about the dir-structure. I think this is also the
way that FHS defines everything (in general).

I know there aren't tools in /usr that should be in /bin etc... since my /u=
sr
is a seperate partition and works great, so I don't think there is a proble=
m.

Has anyone succesfully used Gentoo in a network and with /usr NFS-exported?

Wkr,
	Sven Vermeulen

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--__--__--

Message: 7
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 12:10:54 +0200 (MEST)
From: Manuela Marquardt <manu.marquardt@×××.de>
To: gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: [gentoo-dev] Installation via ISDN or Modem

Hi,

I just wanted to ask if it is possible to install Gentoo Linux using ISDN or
Modem. Or do I have to be connected via LAN/Proxy to the internet?

Sincerely
Manuela Marquardt

--
GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet.
http://www.gmx.net


--__--__--

Message: 8
To: Gentoo-Dev <gentoo-dev@g.o>
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Portage and /usr/local
From: Eric Jacoboni <jaco@××××××××××××.org>
Date: 05 Sep 2002 12:16:01 +0200

>>>>> "Martin" == Martin Schlemmer <azarah@g.o> writes:

Martin> Sure, edit the ebuild and change the --prefix=/usr to
Martin> --prefix=/usr/local.

Yes, i've already done that... But its not enough : considering
gkrellm (my canonical example), the ebuild use the dobin() function
(other ebuilds i've look at, don't...). This function is using the
DESTTREE variable, exported by ebuild.sh. And DESTTREE is set to
/usr... in ebuild.sh.

Changing only --prefix in this case make the whole stuff in /usr/local
but gkrellm2 still goes in /usr/bin.

Martin>  Thus I dont want to say never, but at least not in the next
Martin> couple of months.

Oh yes, it's not a problem: i've posted my first article as a
"request to feature" not as a "bug" ;-) I'm gonna do some tests by
tweaking script files...

--
Éric Jacoboni, né il y a 1334664461 secondes

--__--__--

Message: 9
To: gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Portage and /usr/local
From: Eric Jacoboni <jaco@××××××××××××.org>
Date: 05 Sep 2002 12:59:14 +0200

>>>>> "Marko" == Marko Mikulicic <marko@××××.org> writes:

Marko> If you find more important to have a clean /usr/bin, I wonder if
Marko> having a mess in /usr/local/bin would help.

No, of course. But, can you imagine that, on a Unix system, 'gcc' is
in the same place than 'gkrellm', can you imagine that 'widget' (a
example app from perl/tk) lives with the 'find' command ?

For my own, i'll _never_ consider 'find' and 'gcc' on the same basis
as gkrellm or widget.

Don't know if my english skill is enough to express what i mean...

Marko> The "cleanest" situation is when you have 50% in /usr/bin and 50% in
Marko> /usr/local/bin, since otherways the other
Marko> will be a mess :-)

It's not a matter of repartition, it's a matter of software
categorization.

Marko> Consider for example "non system" software which installs kernel
Marko> modules (for example AVFS, a user mode
Marko> filesystem, or LiS, linux streams implementation. both are not yet
Marko> complete software and cannot be threaded
Marko> like "system" of  "base" installation).

Yes, i know it needs some work ;-)
--
Éric Jacoboni, né il y a 1334667036 secondes

--__--__--

Message: 10
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 18:09:53 +0200
From: drev@××××××.it
To: Manuela Marquardt <manu.marquardt@×××.de>
Cc: gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Installation via ISDN or Modem

On Thu, Sep 05, 2002 at 12:10:54PM +0200, Manuela Marquardt wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I just wanted to ask if it is possible to install Gentoo Linux using ISDN
or
> Modem. Or do I have to be connected via LAN/Proxy to the internet?
>
I've currently installed my gentoo linux using a 56k modem and i found no
problem, except for downloading time.

Just download the stage 1 and untar it to your (clean) future gentoo
partition. mount the partition, chroot to it and follow the installation
instructions.

The network will works. it'slow but works.

Gianluca Guida
> Sincerely
> Manuela Marquardt
>
> --
> GMX - Die Kommunikationsplattform im Internet.
> http://www.gmx.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@g.o
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev

--__--__--

Message: 11
From: "mike" <vapier@×××××××.com>
To: <gentoo-dev@g.o>
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] questions about /var/run and pids
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 11:29:43 -0400

if you look at existing scripts (like /etc/init.d/samba) you see that
they use 'start-stop-daemon' ... for more information on how to
use it, run `start-stop-daemon --help` ...
-mike

----- Original Message -----
From: "Dominik Westner" <lists@×××××××××××.com>
To: <gentoo-dev@g.o>
Sent: Thursday, September 05, 2002 02:52
Subject: [gentoo-dev] questions about /var/run and pids


> Hi all,
>
> when creating some ebuilds I quite often run into the following problem:
>
> I have a daemon program which should run under a specific user.
> Additionally I think a good daemon should always write their pid in
> /var/run.
>
> Problem: /var/run is only writable by root. Therefore only daemons
> which run as root can put their pid into /var/run.
>
> I think a better approach would be to have /var/run owned and being
> writeable by group 'daemon'.
> Every daemon program could then belong to the daemon group and write
> its pid into /var/run.
>
> Or do I simply miss something?
>
> Dominik
>
> _______________________________________________
> gentoo-dev mailing list
> gentoo-dev@g.o
> http://lists.gentoo.org/mailman/listinfo/gentoo-dev
>


--__--__--

Message: 12
Date: Thu, 5 Sep 2002 18:45:19 +0200
From: Thomas Osterlie <gentho@×××××××××.org>
To: gentoo-dev@g.o
Subject: [gentoo-dev] Clearing the clutter

Hi,

I'm in the process of upgrading the JBoss ebuild to the latest JBoss
release, and am in need of some advice.

Here's the deal: JBoss comes with a *LOT* of third-party libraries,
which it relies upon to run with the full monty of features.  With the
original JBoss ebuild I just stuffed all of these third party libraries
in the JBoss file hierarchy.  This time around, however, I'm tempted to
write separate ebuilds for each third party library included, and
instead sym linking them on need (I'm working on a tool to handle
library and service dependencies when adding new server archives to
JBoss).

In my eyes having separate ebuilds for the third-party libraries is a
good thing(tm), as more Java applications can share the same libraries.
This could be a start in solving the inherent problem with Java
applications living as separate islands on the file system, independent
of each other.

The consequence of separating the third-party libraries from the JBoss
installation, however, is that we'd see a growth in the number of
ebuilds in dev-java.  JBoss requires around twenty third-party libraries
for its complete functionality.  That is some twenty odd new ebuilds in
dev-java and possibly some in net-www.  I'm unsure whether this will
result in a cluttered dev-java dir.

I'm tempted to start writing separate ebuilds for the third-party libs,
but want to hear if anyone else have opinions on the matter before I
start with the task.

Cheers,

Thomas Osterlie


--__--__--

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