Gentoo Archives: gentoo-dev

From: Ciaran McCreesh <ciaranm@×××××××.org>
To: gentoo-dev@l.g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] Some council topics for March meeting
Date: Sun, 04 Mar 2007 18:30:23
Message-Id: 20070304182219.4de3ff11@snowdrop
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-dev] Some council topics for March meeting by Daniel Robbins
1 On Sun, 4 Mar 2007 10:03:54 -0700 "Daniel Robbins"
2 <drobbins.daniel@×××××.com> wrote:
3 > In defense of my confusion, certainly appears from the perspective of
4 > the gentoo-dev ml that you are leading at the very least the
5 > day-to-day management of the project.
6
7 No, as I've already told you, I'm just the one who hasn't decided to
8 ignore all this pointless noise yet.
9
10 > PMS is a project that is not an offical Gentoo project, but is
11 > controlled by a Gentoo developer (spb), is hosted on external
12 > infrastructure, does not have a Gentoo Foundation copyright.
13
14 PMS is a QA subproject. It even has a subproject page now.
15
16 > The council may try to impose a deadline on PMS but it is a non-Gentoo
17 > project and thus out of its scope of influence in all areas besides
18 > areas of mutual coordination.
19
20 The Council imposing a deadline upon PMS would have exactly the same
21 effect as the Council imposing a deadline upon anything else.
22
23 > Significant contributions to PMS are coming from Ciaran, someone who
24 > has been explicitly banned from Gentoo development
25
26 Untrue. I haven't been banned from Gentoo development, and I've been
27 contributing to plenty of things for a long time.
28
29 > The specification is designed to document
30 > that functionality that ebuilds can rely on. Paludis, a non-Gentoo
31 > project lead by Ciaran, will likely be the first conformant
32 > implementation, after which the process will begin to get it adopted
33 > as official policy for Gentoo ebuilds, via the Council and QA.
34
35 The first conformant implementation will likely be Portage, unless
36 Portage has some particularly nasty bugs that take a long time to fix.
37
38 Paludis will likely be the first conformant *independent*
39 implementation. An independent implementation is generally considered
40 necessary for something to be a proper standard rather than a
41 description of a program.
42
43
44 > I *think* I have all that right? OK, I will accept this.
45 >
46 > If that's the case, I'm suggesting the following "tweak" to the plans.
47 >
48 > a) move PMS discussion off this list
49
50 That would be great. There has been absolutely nothing of value
51 received from people discussing PMS on this list. Moving it onto a list
52 where the PMS project lead can remove people who contribute nothing to
53 the discussion would be very helpful.
54
55 > It's also not worth keeping PMS on this list for a number of reasons,
56 > and confuses people (me included) as to whether it is an official
57 > Gentoo project.
58
59 If you're confused, it's because you didn't do your research before
60 jumping in with all your accusations.
61
62 > b) You (Ciaran) should unsubscribe from this list.
63 >
64 > Rationale: You (Ciaran) have already been explicitly banned from
65 > Gentoo development
66
67 Untrue.
68
69 > yet are acting as the project's official spokesman on this list which
70 > is clearly a Gentoo development list.
71
72 Also untrue, as you have been told several times.
73
74 > I am asking that you have a basic respect for your removal from
75 > Gentoo, despite your personal feelings, which to me means that you
76 > are not "involved" as a developer on a day-to-day basis and not
77 > working directly with other Gentoo developers - except those that
78 > might want or need to work with you on non-Gentoo projects (who can
79 > then freely interact with you on non-Gentoo lists.)
80
81 Funnily enough, I'm working quite happily with more Gentoo developers
82 that most other Gentoo developers, both on official Gentoo projects and
83 on external projects.
84
85 > This should not impede your work or that of PMS, as interested parties
86 > can just subscribe to those non-Gentoo lists. In fact I expect this
87 > will help to accelerate PMS development dramatically.
88
89 If accelerating PMS development is your goal, I suggest you stop
90 commenting upon it... This thread has become a massive waste of time
91 thanks mainly to your input.
92
93 > *That* is what I have been trying to do, with the priority placed on
94 > getting Gentoo going in the right direction.
95
96 I think you need to step back and admit that at present, you're not
97 familiar enough with how Gentoo is operating to provide any kind of
98 input on that sort of topic. Give yourself time to get back into the
99 flow of things, learn what projects like PMS are *before* you start
100 jumping in on discussions. Apologise to everyone whose time you wasted
101 by making them read this thread if you like, but more importantly don't
102 do it again.
103
104 --
105 Ciaran McCreesh
106 Mail : ciaranm at ciaranm.org
107 Web : http://ciaranm.org/
108 Paludis, the secure package manager : http://paludis.pioto.org/

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Re: [gentoo-dev] Some council topics for March meeting Daniel Robbins <drobbins.daniel@×××××.com>