Gentoo Archives: gentoo-dev

From: Jaco Kroon <jaco@××××××.za>
To: gentoo-dev@l.g.o, "Anthony G. Basile" <blueness@g.o>
Subject: Re: [gentoo-dev] News item for eudev deprecation
Date: Tue, 24 Aug 2021 10:24:28
In Reply to: [gentoo-dev] News item for eudev deprecation by "Anthony G. Basile"
1 Hi All,
3 We run glibc based systems.  No musl.  But we don't use systemd.
5 As little as a year back we still ran into issues with systemd-udev
6 variant breaking systems, the fix of course was to nuke it and install
7 eudev.  Are we certain there is nothing (eg, LVM integration was our
8 biggest problem resulting in really crazy impossible to debug since we
9 can't log in due to lvn snapshot creation/removal deadlocking with
10 systemd-udev - no ask me not how, all I can tell you is that eudev never
11 exhibited this behaviour) will break?
13 Whilst I fully appreciate the difficult of all the various e* packages
14 (elogind, eudev etc ..) and I most certainly do not have the capacity to
15 maintain, and therefore I'm in full support of the concept of
16 deprecating eudev, I'm very, very worried about us suddenly being back
17 into the reboot-a-server-a-week scenario.  In the worst case we've lost
18 some large filesystems almost certainly due to systemd-udev (we've had a
19 number of filesystem crashes which was recovered with fsck, but after
20 ditching systemd-udev and moving to eudev about two years back on this
21 specific host we've had ZERO further problems other than a failed drive
22 or two, none of which required a hard-reset to get back to a sane state).
24 Kind Regards,
25 Jaco
27 On 2021/08/22 22:14, Anthony G. Basile wrote:
28 > Hi everyone,
29 >
30 > Yes! It is time to finally deprecate eudev! sys-fs/udev now builds
31 > under musl! My original purpose for maintaining eudev was because
32 > systemd + musl did not play well together when udev was absorbed into
33 > the sytemd repo. Now thanks to patches from openembedded, they do, and
34 > my original reason for maintaining eudev is no longer valid. So its
35 > time to retire eudev. It has served its purpose as a stop-gap.
36 >
37 > To me, this is a success for musl, and I would like to thank all the
38 > developers who have taken musl seriously enough to make this happen :)
39 >
40 > I am willing to transfer the eudev repo to another organization, but I
41 > will not maintain it anymore and Base System doesn't want to either.
42 > Let me warn people, to maintain it correctly you MUST become familiar
43 > with its internals and watch what systemd is doing upstream to keep up.
44 > This is not trivial. I learned a lot from eudev, and it did save musl
45 > on gentoo, but there was a period there when it was taking up almost all
46 > of my time. If you don't know what you're getting into, you don't want
47 > to take on its maintenance.
48 >
49 >
50 >
51 > Title: eudev retirement on 2022-01-01
52 > Author: Anthony G. Basile <blueness@g.o>
53 > Posted: 2021-08-xx
54 > Revision: 1
55 > News-Item-Format: 2.0
56 > Display-If-Installed: sys-fs/eudev
57 >
58 > sys-fs/udev is becoming the standard provider of udev on non-systemd
59 > (e.g. OpenRC) systems. Users of systemd will continue to use the udev
60 > services provided by the sys-apps/systemd package itself.
61 >
62 > The transition should be uneventful in most cases, but please read this
63 > item in full to understand some possible corner cases.
64 >
65 > eudev will be retired and removed from Gentoo on 2022-01-01. We will
66 > start masking eudev on 2021-10-01 and give people 3 months to prepare
67 > their transition. You should ensure that sys-fs/eudev is not in your
68 > world file by running
69 >
70 > emerge --deselect sys-fs/eudev
71 >
72 > in order for Portage to replace eudev with sys-fs/udev once the
73 > package.mask is in place. We fully support udev on musl, whereas uclibc
74 > will still have to rely on eudev before also being removed on 2022-01-01.
75 >
76 > **WARNING**
77 >
78 > If you happen to have an INSTALL_MASK with a blanket "*systemd*" glob,
79 > you will inevitably break your system. sys-fs/udev contains "systemd" in
80 > some of its filenames, hence a blanket filter rule will likely lead to a
81 > non-functional udev installation.
82 >
83 > Rationale
84 >
85 > The integration of udev into the systemd git repo introduced numerous
86 > problems for none-glibc systems, such as musl and uclibc. Several
87 > options were considered, and the one chosen was to fork and maintain
88 > udev independant of the rest of systemd. This was meant as a stop-gap
89 > solution until such time as the problems with systemd on musl had been
90 > resolved. This is now the case with patches provided by openembedded,
91 > and my original reason for maintaining eudev is no longer relevant.
92 >
93 > I am willing to transfer eudev to another umbrella organisation or Linux
94 > distribution that is willing to continue its maintenance, but
95 > maintaining eudev cannot be done purely through proxy-maintaining and
96 > requires an understanding of its internals. This is a steep learning
97 > curve and must be an earnest effort. For this reason, the Base System
98 > project has decided not to support euev as an option going forward.
99 >


Subject Author
Re: [gentoo-dev] News item for eudev deprecation "Anthony G. Basile" <blueness@g.o>
Re: [gentoo-dev] News item for eudev deprecation Sam James <sam@g.o>