1 |
On 09/17/2014 09:58 AM, Rich Freeman wrote: |
2 |
> There was a thread a while back about mix-in support and I think there |
3 |
> was genuine interest. For the most part we just need to do the work, |
4 |
> and the first step is identifying blockers. If some end up involving |
5 |
> PMS/etc then we may need to get the Council involved. |
6 |
> |
7 |
> Rather than hijacking every @system change discussion with this, I |
8 |
> created a tracker at: |
9 |
> https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=523036 |
10 |
|
11 |
The funtoo mixin system has absolutely nothing to do with adding |
12 |
packages to stage3 that are not in @system. |
13 |
|
14 |
Primarily adding packages to stage3 (or stage4 if we choose to call it |
15 |
that) would only need us to agree on the packages.default bug: |
16 |
https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=393445 |
17 |
|
18 |
The primary issue here is do we add the "default" packages to the world |
19 |
file or not. |
20 |
|
21 |
I'll provide an extremely biased reasoning for both sides: |
22 |
|
23 |
If we add packages to the world file, then the default programs won't be |
24 |
immediately eligible to depclean, and the user would have to manually |
25 |
ask portage to remove them if they don't want them. No package.provided |
26 |
hacks, just normal "emerge -C blah". The downside to this is that we |
27 |
would be shipping a stage with a populated world file. This solution |
28 |
provides a very simple opt out of the packages that the user doesn't |
29 |
want (just remove them) and no accidental removals. |
30 |
|
31 |
If we don't add packages to the world file, then the default programs |
32 |
will be immediately eligible to depclean, and may be accidently wiped |
33 |
EVERY time depclean is run unless the user does "emerge --noreplace |
34 |
blah" for every single package they want to keep. This solution may |
35 |
cause users to accidently depclean needed utilities from their systems |
36 |
and have difficultly getting them back. For instance if virtual/editor |
37 |
is removed from @system and moved to packages.default (it should be) |
38 |
then a depclean right after install would remove the system editor and |
39 |
leave the user unable to edit files until they rebuild it (assuming they |
40 |
don't need to edit any files like make.conf to do so). As I'm not a fan |
41 |
of crippling users by surprise, it should be obvious I think this idea |
42 |
is bad. |
43 |
|
44 |
Again, I'm incredibly biased, and as such, I've refused to work on this |
45 |
bug because there is no agreement on the solution and I refuse to help |
46 |
enable the solution where needed programs can be accidentally depcleaned |
47 |
(as with nano, openssh, etc, all would be after we remove them from the |
48 |
system set). I refuse to be responsible for people accidentally |
49 |
depcleaning things like openssh, I don't care that they didn't read the |
50 |
--depclean -p output, that's not a valid excuse to cripple users by default. |
51 |
> |
52 |
> If somebody beats me to it, feel free to dig through the past |
53 |
> discussions and add blockers. I know updating eselect is necessary. |
54 |
> I suspect portage will be fine if we just turn /etc/make/profile into |
55 |
> a directory and have it inherit other profiles. Actually creating |
56 |
> some mix-in profiles will need to be done, but probably not in the |
57 |
> main tree until we have more of the blockers resolved. We also need |
58 |
> to see how other package managers handle this, and work with them, |
59 |
> possibly including a PMS change. |
60 |
> |
61 |
> I'd like to get to a point where we can all have our cakes and eat it |
62 |
> too, and not have endless arguments about whether openssh or whatever |
63 |
> belongs in @system. |
64 |
|
65 |
No, we can move those arguments to if things belong in packages.default :-) |
66 |
|
67 |
-Zero_Chaos |
68 |
> |
69 |
> -- |
70 |
> Rich |
71 |
> |
72 |
> |