Gentoo Archives: gentoo-java

From: Andrew John Hughes <gnu_andrew@××××××××××.org>
To: Robert Burrell Donkin <robertburrelldonkin@×××××.com>
Cc: gentoo-java@l.g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-java] OpenJDK, IcedTea and Package Naming
Date: Sun, 14 Sep 2008 14:26:30
Message-Id: 17c6771e0809140726u47b5a806i291aeefb68decae3@mail.gmail.com
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-java] OpenJDK, IcedTea and Package Naming by Robert Burrell Donkin
1 2008/9/14 Robert Burrell Donkin <robertburrelldonkin@×××××.com>:
2 > On Sun, Sep 14, 2008 at 2:21 AM, Andrew John Hughes
3 > <gnu_andrew@××××××××××.org> wrote:
4 >> 2008/9/13 Robert Burrell Donkin <robertburrelldonkin@×××××.com>:
5 >
6 > <snip>
7 >
8 >>> AIUI and IMNSHO *NO* local build from source qualifies. gentoo
9 >>> *SHOULD* *NOT* expose users to risk by using trademarks etc for *ANY*
10 >>> source build even from the sun tree.
11 >>>
12 >>
13 >> Maybe that's being a bit over cautious,
14 >
15 > i agree that sun is unlikely to sue any users over java ATM but
16 > trademarks must be defended or cease to exist. sooner or later sun
17 > will have to either lose the java trademark or act against
18 > unauthorised users.
19 >
20
21 I wasn't talking about the Java trademark, I was talking about the OpenJDK
22 trademark. Use of the Java trademark requires passing the
23 certification process,
24 and this isn't possible for a source build. Only binaries can pass
25 the TCK and thus
26 be certified.
27
28 >> but the problem generally is
29 >> Sun thought of this with binary distribution in mind, not source.
30 >
31 > the JCP is set up to manage binaries, not source. IMO this is the
32 > fatal flaw in this system. (i'll avoid going OT by repeating the
33 > argument again here.)
34 >
35
36 Yes, the JCP still needs work, being centered around proprietary
37 binary distribution for the most part.
38
39 >> As with any legal agreement, the best solution is to consult a lawyer.
40 >> I'm not one.
41 >
42 > does gentoo have a agreement with sun?
43 > if so, is it available on line?
44 > if not, what agreement is being relyed on?
45 >
46
47 Not as far as I know, but other than naming and trademarks, OpenJDK is just
48 like any other FOSS project.
49
50 >>> BTW i'm on AMD64 which has very poor support from the sun java
51 >>> codebase. are there any plans to add support for the harmony VM?
52 >>>
53 >>
54 >> What 'poor support'? IcedTea6 works fine for me here on amd64.
55 >
56 > eclipse and sun don't play well. however, i haven't tried switching to
57 > the iced tea build on gentoo so maybe i'll give that a try next time.
58 >
59 >> Feel free to package Harmony, but I don't see how that will solve your problems,
60 >
61 > harmony runs eclipse fine. every couple of months when gentoo changes
62 > something, i have to devote a couple of hours fixing stuff so that
63 > eclipse works or else switch to harmony until everything's fixed.
64 >
65
66 That's interesting. I don't know anything about the proprietary Sun
67 builds on amd64, I've
68 never used them. But I also don't run Eclipse. Have you filled
69 appropriate bugs?
70 Certainly try IcedTea and, if you get failures, report them to our bug
71 database at
72 http://icedtea.classpath.org/bugzilla.
73
74 >> given it doesn't yet have a complete implementation of even 1.5.
75 >
76 > if sun had honoured it's agreement to allow access to the TCK by open
77 > source projects, then harmony (and the free JVMs) would have had
78 > certified 1.5 implementations a year ago and (most likely) 1.6 ones as
79 > well by now. this is a political issue, not a code one.
80 >
81
82 I seriously doubt that, given it took OpenJDK a year to pass the 1.6
83 TCK, despite
84 being based on a codebase, the majority of which has passed as part of
85 the proprietary work.
86
87 > - robert
88 >
89 >
90
91
92
93 --
94 Andrew :-)
95
96 Support Free Java!
97 Contribute to GNU Classpath and the OpenJDK
98 http://www.gnu.org/software/classpath
99 http://openjdk.java.net
100
101 PGP Key: 94EFD9D8 (http://subkeys.pgp.net)
102 Fingerprint: F8EF F1EA 401E 2E60 15FA 7927 142C 2591 94EF D9D8

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Re: [gentoo-java] OpenJDK, IcedTea and Package Naming Robert Burrell Donkin <robertburrelldonkin@×××××.com>