Gentoo Archives: gentoo-project

From: Daniel Campbell <lists@××××××××.us>
To: gentoo-project@l.g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Call for agenda items - Council meeting 2013-09-10
Date: Thu, 19 Sep 2013 13:33:16
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-project] Call for agenda items - Council meeting 2013-09-10 by Tom Wijsman
1 On 09/19/2013 07:37 AM, Tom Wijsman wrote:
2 > On Wed, 18 Sep 2013 23:33:47 -0500
3 > Daniel Campbell <lists@××××××××.us> wrote:
4 >
5 >> On 09/18/2013 05:42 AM, heroxbd@g.o wrote:
6 >>> Hey Daniel,
7 >>>
8 >>> Daniel Campbell <lists@××××××××.us> writes:
9 >>>
10 >>>> As a user, I've considered becoming a developer but the process is
11 >>>> rather contrived and multi-tiered.
12 >>>
13 >>> Would you like to try again? Where did you get stuck last time?
14 >>>
15 >>
16 >> The organizational and social aspects of it pushed me away the most.
17 >> I'm completely okay with a test that ensures that you either know what
18 >> you're doing or are resourceful enough to figure it out when in doubt.
19 >> It's Gentoo as an organization that seems foreboding and intimidating.
20 >> One must wonder if they should bother applying, if they're good
21 >> enough, if a mistake would end the work they put in to become a
22 >> developer, etc.
23 >
24 > It kind of depends on how you think about it; if I were to wrote the
25 > a paragraph about the same matter, but in a different way it would be:
26 >
27 > The organizational and social aspects is what would attract me the most.
28 > I'm not okay with a test that just ensures that you know what you do or
29 > are resourceful enough to figure things out when in doubt; no, I would
30 > love Gentoo as an organization to help me obtain more experience on top
31 > of that. One shouldn't bother about being good enough for applying, the
32 > recruitment helps ensure that the most mistakes aren't made.
33 >
34 > In other words, you shouldn't see the recruitment quiz and reviews as a
35 > driver exam where you either pass or fail; no, we let you test drive on
36 > a consolidated piece of the world and open the gates to the real world
37 > once you have become acquainted and sharpened your driving skills.
38 >
39 > If you then make a careful accidental mistake, no need to worry.
40 >
42 That's a bit reassuring. It's difficult to understand an organization
43 from the outside, so forgive me if I (or others) get the wrong idea.
45 >> Additionally, I couldn't really come up with a solid goal to work on;
46 >> an answer to "why do you want to become a developer?" My computing
47 >> interests lie in problems that are already solved for the most part
48 >> (IOW I don't know how to find an unsolved problem). My favorite
49 >> software already has capable maintainers on Gentoo, as well.
50 >
51 > Yes, that's one of the reasons people apply; but with the amount of
52 > developers for most software that's going to be true. Regardless of
53 > that, a particular piece of software being already maintained doesn't
54 > mean that you can't help maintain them; there's always something to do
55 > in those areas so manpower is often welcome. Contacting the people to
56 > see if there are things to do, whether you could join a herd (or
57 > maintain a package) once you become a Gentoo Developer and more are
58 > possible things you could do; don't assume that they will say "no". :)
59 >
60 >> So if I
61 >> found myself as a developer, I don't know what I would work on. I'm
62 >> interested in writing better guides for things, making corrections,
63 >> updating out-dated stuff, and wouldn't mind adding new packages to
64 >> portage, but that strikes me as something general that all developers
65 >> pretty much do already.
66 >
67 > Yes, that's the second reason; helping out people or giving back to the
68 > community are things you could do, and if you want to do just that
69 > there's certainly always something to do in that terrain.
70 >
71 >> I've thought about giving it a try, but I don't want to waste people's
72 >> time if someone more useful applies. This conflicts with my desire to
73 >> learn and improve, because you can't learn everything alone. So I'm
74 >> stuck.
75 >
76 > We don't rank our developers; so, if you maintain a particular package
77 > or are part of a particular herd you won't be removed from that any
78 > time soon and I see no reason that it would be a waste of time.
79 > Everything you do helps yourself as well as Gentoo Linux; even if you
80 > don't think it does, it actually does; both gain experience.
81 >
82 >> Sorry for the long, personal answer. I would've responded sooner but I
83 >> wanted to give the question some thought.
84 >
85 > No problem, you also clarify matters for other possible future recruits
86 > so this could perhaps be used as a sub thread to point people with such
87 > wonders to in the future. Or we could capture this into the Gentoo Wiki.
88 >
90 Thanks for the clarification and insight. I don't mind if you use
91 content from this discussion on the wiki or other documentation to
92 better educate users. This list probably doesn't get a lot of user
93 exposure, so something meant for their eyes could change the mindset of
94 some users and motivate them to step up and lighten the load.
96 My apologies to Rich for derailing the thread. It's a habit I'm trying
97 to get rid of.