Gentoo Archives: gentoo-project

From: "Robin H. Johnson" <robbat2@g.o>
To: gentoo-project@l.g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-project] Proposal for Council: Prohibit Harassment & Discrimination via the CoC
Date: Sun, 26 Apr 2015 00:47:50
Message-Id: 20150426004746.GT11903@orbis-terrarum.net
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-project] Proposal for Council: Prohibit Harassment & Discrimination via the CoC by Ciaran McCreesh
1 You chopped out the prior context from Rich, and I'm adding it back:
2 ---
3 >>> Jaywalking is illegal in many jurisdictions. Gentoo shouldn't care if
4 >>> you've gotten a jaywalking citation. Gentoo should care if you harass
5 >>> somebody at a conference, especially if wearing a Gentoo badge, or if
6 >>> your behavior becomes associated with Gentoo publicly.
7 ---
8 On Sat, Apr 25, 2015 at 09:54:50PM +0100, Ciaran McCreesh wrote:
9 > On Sat, 25 Apr 2015 20:42:26 +0000
10 > "Robin H. Johnson" <robbat2@g.o> wrote:
11 > > Should having a criminal record be a protected minority group? That's
12 > > unknown; but if somebody actively does something criminal and confers
13 > > the negative outcome of such to be associated with Gentoo, then yes,
14 > > Gentoo as an organization and community most definitely should care.
15 > > Furthermore, just because they do something very distasteful but
16 > > technically legal in some jurisdiction, doesn't make it any better.
17 > Your ban on people convicted of homosexuality-related or
18 > driving-while-female crimes contradicts your ban on discrimination. You
19 > have to pick a side on this one: there are plenty of places, including
20 > certain US states, where participating in or advocating things on your
21 > "protected classes" list is a crime.
22 <sarcasm>
23 Great, I'll be sure to come to next Gentoo miniconf when it's help in
24 Uganda or Saudi Arabia, so you can help uphold their laws.
25 </sarcasm>
26
27 Yes, if you pick and choose your laws over various jurisdictions, you
28 can pick apart each and every protected class on the list. So it comes
29 down to these decisions:
30 1. Is the law relevant to the scope of what Gentoo does?
31 2. Is the law (that the protection is based on) reasonable in a global
32 scope?
33 3. Should Gentoo refuse/cut-back on business in those locations?
34
35 Salesforce reducing their business in Indiana in light of legal changes
36 there is a great example for #3, because they feel those new laws are
37 unreasonable (the CEO was cited as calling the law as brutal, unfair &
38 unjust).
39
40 Criminality is not a protected class in my proposal, and regardless of
41 your arguments, it's sufficiently nuanced that adding it would cause
42 more problems than it solves.
43
44 Rich laid it out well, that Gentoo shouldn't care if you get a
45 jaywalking citation (even while covered in Gentoo branding, carrying a
46 giant Larry); Gentoo should care if you harass somebody at a conference,
47 or in an email thread on the Gentoo lists (or on third-party lists, with
48 your @gentoo.org address).
49
50 Gentoo should ALSO care if it comes to light that individuals with past
51 history of incidents are participating in the community. Eg: [1a][1b]
52 [1a] http://www.eventbrite.com/e/ignite-bridgetown-part-of-portland-startup-week-tickets-15491321961
53 [1b] http://crystalbeasley.com/2015/02/04/I-stand-against-kveton/
54 How it should deal with any such individuals I don't have a good answer
55 to, but should be considered in CoC changes.
56
57 --
58 Robin Hugh Johnson
59 Gentoo Linux: Developer, Infrastructure Lead
60 E-Mail : robbat2@g.o
61 GnuPG FP : 11ACBA4F 4778E3F6 E4EDF38E B27B944E 34884E85

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