Re: [gentoo-user] Pick your hypothesis:

[Dale]

Alan Grimes wrote:
> Michael Jones wrote:
>> My reason for replying initially was that I didn't think it was fair
>> to make light of users who don't expect to *need* to scrutinize the
>> output of emerge every single time they run it. Those people exist
>> (hi, nice to meet you), and it's not fair to say they're wrong or
>> somehow making a grave error in judgement.
>>
>> It's entirely fair to say that they are treading on thin ice, and that
>> if they choose to do this they should understand the risks, but it's
>> not fair to say they're automatically wrong to use the tool in a way
>> that the tool allows itself to be used.
>>
>> Either way, we don't need to turn this into a long and in depth
>> discussion, so I probably won't reply to the list again unless you
>> have any specific questions or concerns for me.
> Thank you for the reasonable response.
>
> Dale, of course, has spewed hate at me for simply trying to make my life
> as convenient as possible while still using Gentoo over here without
> even providing a satisfactory answer as to why.
>

Spewed hate?  Make your life convenient?  I went back and looked at
threads you posted several years ago, before your posting privileges
were stopped, not sure what action was taken just that you didn't post
for a while.  Back then, Neil, the other Alan, myself and several others
were trying to help you.  Mostly, it was pointed out that the script you
were using was causing problems and was certainly not making things
easier much less convenient.  That's not spewing hate.  That's trying to
help you with the problem.  I might add, I was one of very few who kept
trying to help when others had already stopped replying to you.  Maybe
you forgot that??

If you want a easy way to update your system, I'll list what I do here
and it has worked for a long time.  I been using Gentoo since early
2003.  Sure, sometimes I run into a issue that I need help on but that
isn't to often.  When it does, I post all the info I think is needed for
others to look at and advise on how to proceed.  Sometimes, it is a
change upstream, sometimes it is something I have going on on my end. 
Either way, I adjust to the fix. 

First, sync the tree and any related overlays.  I use eix-sync since it
does all of it in one command.  It syncs the tree and any overlays at
the same time.  My first command looks like this.

eix-sync && emerge -uvaDN world

Since I have some default options in make.conf, it ends up like this for
emerge.

emerge --jobs=5 --update --backtrack=100 --keep-going --verbose --newuse
--oneshot --quiet-build=n --with-bdeps=y --unordered-display --ask
--deep world

That looks long but most of that is in make.conf so that I don't have to
type it all in every time.  I also see I can leave off the -u since it
is in make.conf.  Once the sync is done, it then runs emerge to see what
packages are going to be updated, what their USE flags are and if emerge
will have any issues emerging them such as hard blocks or USE flag
conflicts.  I always check for what is being installed new, what USE
flags are changing and for upgrades to packages I specifically installed
myself.  Most changes in the list are color coded.  It makes it very
easy to see what is changing.  If I see something changing that I don't
want or want handled another way, I go edit the needed config file(s)
and run emerge again to see if it is like I want.  Sometimes, that takes
a few times.  Sometimes, it works fine the very first time.  Once it is
like I want/need, I then hit y and let emerge proceed with the update. 
At this point, you can walk away.  I run some packages unstable and
still it is rare that a package fails.  I might add, going over that
list usually takes less than five minutes, even if I have to edit a
config file to get things like I want. 

Odds are, if you do it that way, it will work almost every time.  The
thing is, you have to stay on top of it and update on a regular basis. 
I saw that was mentioned a few times several years ago.  Gentoo supports
going a year without a update but it doesn't mean that updating a system
10, 12 or 13 months out of date is going to be easy.  Depending on what
changes has been made, it could be difficult. 

Maybe when you get the current issue sorted out, you will at least
consider this a starting point for doing what is known to work well.  It
took me years to get to this point.  As options are added to emerge, I
adjust make.conf to make things work better.  Thing is, I don't mind
sharing a good way to update and save someone else a lot of issues. 
It's up to them whether they want to use it or not. 

I hope this will help you after you get the current problem fixed. 

Dale

:-)  :-)