Re: [gentoo-dev] Making systemd more accessible to "normal" users

[William Hubbs]

On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 02:18:13PM -0400, waltdnes@××××××××.org wrote:
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 03:41:31PM +0200, Fabio Erculiani wrote
> > Are we realizing that in order to keep systemd out of our way, we're
> > currently writing and maintaining drop-in replacements for the
> > features that systemd is already providing in an actively maintained
> > state? openrc-settingsd was the first thing that we as Gentoo
> > developers (Pacho?) had to write in order to merge GNOME 3.6 into our
> > tree.
>
>   So Redhat, who are heavily into GNOME
> ( http://fedoraproject.org/wiki/Red_Hat_contributions#GNOME_developers )
> decided to make GNOME depend on other Redhat-developed software (systemd
> and pulseadio).  Well... like... dohhhh...
>
>   Question... when Sun made OpenOffice depend on Java (also a Sun
> product) did Gentoo developers run around suggesting that Java be made a
> part of the core Gentoo base system?  I don't think so.  If a user wants
> to run GNOME badly enough, he'll switch to systemd.  I don't see why the
> rest of us (i.e. non-users of GNOME) should have to follow along and
> reconfigure our systems.  This is a case of the tail wagging the dog.
 
 I don't interpret what he is saying that way. I think what he is
 talking about is that we are trying to get teams to support non-systemd
 setups when upstreams do not, like with gnome.

 Gnome now has a hard dependency on systemd (for gnome newer than 3.8).
 Some folks want to use gnome without systemd and are putting that under
 the gentoo is about choice banner and want us to support them.

> > So what do we want to do then? Isolate from the rest of the world?
> > (It's not a sarcastic question). I hope that everybody does their
> > own reality check.
>
>   You are effectively calling not-using-GNOME isolationist.  Let's just
> say I disagree with you on that.  BTW, see my sig.

See above.

William