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Hi. |
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|
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José Luis Rivero (yoswink) wrote: |
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> Roy Marples wrote: |
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>> |
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>> I maintain and play a game called Eternal Lands. I'm a Council member, |
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>> but not part of the games team/herd. |
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>> |
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>> One of the problems games have with stable/unstable/testing/whatever |
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>> keywords is that upstream changes things that in any other application |
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>> just would not change. For example, the network protocol when talking |
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>> to servers. EL is very version specific and when a new client is |
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>> launched, around once every 6 months they change over right away. That |
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>> means our users need the game right away. |
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> |
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> Thanks for the example, trust me if I tell you that we can understand |
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> the situation pretty well. |
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> |
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>> |
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>> I used to commit EL straight to stable for this very reason, but now |
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>> after a few Gentoo QA people bitched EL will never ever have a stable |
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>> keyword. |
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> |
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> I'm nearly sure that you always (at least) compile and run the new |
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> version in your box before you sent it to stable, didn't you? So, at |
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> least, you are able to say that it works in your case. |
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> |
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>> So instead I periodically have to let our users know how to |
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>> unmask EL just so they can play their game. |
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> |
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> There are always ways to educate users about how to use portage properly. |
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> |
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>> So no, in many cases NOT committing straight to stable CAN be |
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>> detrimental to our users if all they want is a games machine. You could |
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>> argue that they shouldn't be using Gentoo, but I would argue why should |
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>> we discriminate? |
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>> |
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> |
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> Ehm, IMHO call it discriminate is a big hard. Are the gnome-2.18 or |
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> beryl users discriminated or they should be using something different to |
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> Gentoo? They only thing people have to do is use some ~arch branch |
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> packages, which isn't too difficult (in Gentoo). |
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> |
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|
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Agreed. |
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All Gentoo beryl users need to use ~arch. I don't think games are so |
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special that we must provide them on stable arch. Afertall, if games are |
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keyworded testing, users can add them to /etc/portage/packaage.keywords |
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if they run a stable system. |
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|
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> This is how I see it: |
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> |
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> Problem with keywording straight to stable is that arch teams are very |
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> zealous about our stable branch. We put a lot of time trying things to |
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> not fail in stable, and if an app is broken, we prefer to not force the |
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> users to compile and install another broken (or unknown to be broken) |
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> version and work to fix the current stable (patches or bumping) together |
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> with the maintainer. |
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> |
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> But if you send things, that you can't try, to stable, the qa baby jesus |
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> will cry if it fails, because nobody has taken care of even compile it |
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> in the arch :) |
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> |
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> Games are not part of core system, so IMHO, use the ~arch branch to have |
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> the latest cool version to enjoy, could be a good way to go for those |
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> el1te gam3rs. |
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> |
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> Thanks. |
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> |
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|
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I also don't agree with having an exception for the games herd. As |
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others have questioned, how are games more important than security |
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bumps? If we were considering exceptions, I would argue that allowing |
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the security team to mark packages as stable would make a lot more |
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sense, imho. |
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|
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Anyway, the important point here for the council meeting is whether our |
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keywording policy is to be enforced or not, regardless of herd, or if / |
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how we want to have exceptions. |
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|
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DISCLAIMER: I have no problems with games. I do like to play some, but I |
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see no problem with using package.keywords. |
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|
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- -- |
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Jorge Vicetto (jmbsvicetto) - jmbsvicetto at gentoo dot org |
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Gentoo-forums / Userrel / Proctors |
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