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On Thu, 2003-08-14 at 08:08, Heinrich Wendel wrote: |
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> 2.) There are ppl that say, the proposed solution is to much work, why not |
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> base on the current situation and create a wrapper around the gnome and kde |
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> menus. But what will we do if KDE or GNOME changes it menu-system, we have to |
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> change ours as well. The proposed solution will be completly independent from |
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> KDE and GNOME. I also want to qoute spider: |
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|
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I believe I was more thinking not that it is too much work, but rather |
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too much *pointless* work. I do not feel we should be changing |
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literally hundreds of upstream packages to make them put their desktop |
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entries in the location we want, then have our menu system generate the |
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legacy menus for each window manager. I think it would be much simpler |
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to leave the current window manager's menu system alone and create our |
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own. |
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|
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For example, Gnome uses /usr/share/applications as the location for menu |
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items in version 2+. It uses /usr/share/gnome/apps for versions below |
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that. The new versions still have support for the old style menus to |
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allow older applications to be in the new Gnome menu. |
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|
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Now, I have USE=menu in my make.conf and I emerge gnome. This applies a |
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SINGLE patch to the gnome-panel ebuild which changes the default |
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location of the Gnome system menu to /usr/share/gentoo-menu, where we |
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store our Gentoo-created menus. Now, when gnome-games emerges, it puts |
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all of its .desktop entries in /usr/share/applications. At the end of |
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the ebuild, a do_menu function is run which takes the .desktop entries |
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added by the gnome-games ebuild and parses them. It then creates |
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entries in the /usr/share/gnome-menu directory which meet our menu |
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specifications. This way, if USE=-menu, NOTHING has changed for the |
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user. |
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|
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> "consider that we don't have to provide massive fileupdates, global lists |
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> coherent with our tree, but each capable and installed package requires |
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> a small change that goes back and forwards with versions without |
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> overhead for versionbumps." |
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|
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I see no reason to change hundreds of application ebuilds, when changing |
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the window managers themselves is much simpler and more succinct. Yes, |
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the application ebuilds will have to be modified to add the do_menu |
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function, but I have no problem with this simple change which makes no |
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real changes to the actual upstream package, rather than changing the |
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locations of where a package chooses to install its desktop entries. I |
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may be misunderstanding exactly how your proposal is designed to |
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generate the menus, but I see mine as extremely unobtrusive to both the |
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developer (or user) creating the ebulds, and also to the end-users who |
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choose to NOT use our menu system. |
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|
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> 3.) Implementation issues, like icons, we can discuss that later. |
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Agreed on that. I just wanted to point out that there is already a |
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default location for "default" icons. Icon themes are handled |
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differently by each window manager. (Uh oh, I see another proposal |
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coming up... ;p) |
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|
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> And finally i want to quote seemants post ;) |
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> |
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> "Wow, this thread is just getting silly. For the nay-sayers who just |
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> want to "add my own menu entries, thank you" have you actually READ what |
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> the proposal was? Did you not see that the thing is optional? Further, |
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> did you not see that it will NOT overwrite the application's native menu |
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> stuff? |
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> |
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> For the developers who won't go and change their ebuilds -- are you sure |
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> you've got the end-user's best interests at heart? Having been part of |
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> the distro for damned near 20 months now, "why doesn't gentoo have an |
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> automated menu system?" is among the top 10 most frequently asked |
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> questions. If you won't switch them, we'll find a developer who will. |
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> |
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> Please, stop this flame rubbish already." |
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|
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I don't think any of us are considering denying the users of anything. |
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However, I think we (well, at least I) are wanting to just have more |
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discussion and much more input on how this would be implemented to try |
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to accommodate as much of the user base as possible. |
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|
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-- |
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Chris Gianelloni |
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Developer, Gentoo Linux |