[gentoo-dev] Re: Agenda [WAS: One-Day Gentoo Council Reminder for June]

[Duncan]

Chris Gianelloni <wolf31o2@g.o> posted
1213839792.4449.7.camel@××××××××××××××××.org, excerpted below, on  Wed, 18
Jun 2008 18:43:12 -0700:

> Quite frankly, I'd prefer see Gentoo
> take control over the specification that defines the most important
> single feature of Gentoo and remove the non-Gentoo developers from its
> development.

Leaving the history aside (I posted my personal feelings a week or so 
ago, no need to rehash), we have a serious practical problem with any 
proposal to take direct control of PMS and boot the main current 
contributors.

The problem is -- like him or not, and like the problem or not, Ciaran is 
the ONE person who pushed and pushed on PMS, ultimately got the thing 
going, and continues to be the prime mover behind it.

Now, part of that may be the result of the caustic style, no argument 
there.  However, the fact is, he's and the other paludis folks are 
putting in the hard time that has to be put in to get the thing done.  
Nobody else is, either on their repository or on the Gentoo controlled 
one.  In fact, last I knew, the Gentoo one tended not to be up to date 
and was often going weeks between any action at all (tho talk was of 
moving the active one to Gentoo hosting, don't know if it ever happened 
or not).

Whatever our disagreements or dislikes for each other, the practical 
situation is that Ciaran and friends are doing what no one else took time 
to do, and, were we to forcibly remove them from their current activity 
on it, I'd put the chances at over 70% it'd end up stagnating pretty 
fast.  That's the problem with scrapping and starting over, too, except 
even more so.  I'd put the chances of a redo project ever reaching even 
/this/ far at less than 20%.  

So, while we might not particularly like the persons doing it, if we 
consider it worthwhile and useful to have done, we pretty much gotta work 
with them, because they /are/ doing it -- no one else was or is, nor, 
practically speaking, do I see anybody else having the discipline, time 
and talent to stick to it and get it done, right, regardless of likes or 
dislikes.

Now, it may indeed be that having a working and adopted PMS or alike 
document isn't worth the trouble.  It's the council, backed by individual 
devs, that ultimately decides such things.  However, I believe it's 
worthwhile to face the facts, and know that if we /do/ nix this, we're 
probably nixing the entire idea for some years at least.  Whether it's 
worth it or not I can't say, but that's what we're talking, in terms of 
cost, one way or the other.  We either take this, like or not who doing 
it, or we don't, and we lose all the benefits, for now and perhaps 
forever, but also lose the poison.  Honestly, I'm glad I'm not one of 
those having to make that decision.

-- 
Duncan - List replies preferred.   No HTML msgs.
"Every nonfree program has a lord, a master --
and if you use the program, he is your master."  Richard Stallman

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