Re: [gentoo-project] Comrel Improvements: Expectations of Privacy

[William L. Thomson Jr.]

On Monday, October 3, 2016 1:49:47 PM EDT Rich Freeman wrote:
>
> This assumes that what is good for Gentoo is more developers, and what
> is bad for Gentoo is less developers.

Is the amount of open source software increasing or decreasing?

Just about every aspect of Gentoo is lacking manpower. I am not aware of any 
part of Gentoo that is over staffed. You cannot always pick the ideal person 
to get involved, with the perfect personality and skills. At some point Gentoo 
as a project needs to learn to work with what it has, good or bad, for the 
good of it all.
 
> By that argument we shouldn't have Comrel at all, and we should give
> dev access to anybody who asks for it.

That is closer to how Gentoo started. It would be interesting to see when 
comrel/devrel came into existence and the impact on the project since then. 
Devrel/comrel was not present when Gentoo first started as a project. It came 
about later on.

> The criteria Comrel should be judged on is whether it is correctly
> apply the Code of Conduct.

Gentoo is a technical project, not a social one. Social conduct should not 
hold back development. Social conflict is inevitable in technology not to 
mention international development with different cultures, language 
translations etc.

Tech is known for people who do not act right or nicely. I have never heard 
anyone say Bill Gates, Steve Jobs, Mark Zuckerburg, Larry Ellison and many 
others were nice guys... Many were known if not famous for not being nice 
guys... You need strong personalities and at times brute force to get things 
done.

Darwin is not about being nice but surviving.  Gentoo's goal should not be the 
most peaceful distro or development process. It should be to have the latest 
of all software, which means there will be conflicts, at the technical level 
and otherwise.

If adherence to a CoC makes Gentoo suffer in any way technically. Then it 
should be modified to suit the technical direction, not social.

> While I certainly would prefer to see developers change their behavior
> than see them be kicked out, I'd rather see them be kicked out than
> see them continue their previous behavior if it is egregious.

There is more to it than just kicked out. There are those like me who are 
motivated to lose interest. I believe many more have voluntarily left the 
project as I did, than were kicked out.

Losing developers and talent will never be good for Gentoo. Not unless they 
are replaced with another or two or more. Thus far that is not the case. Most 
developers lost are not replaced.

I am ok with comrel/recruiting driving people away either by force or 
motivation. But either way they should be replacing them, yet make no effort 
to do such.

> By the time Comrel steps in a problem already exists.

Not always, but do we have facts to go on?

At least in my case in 2008, the problem was resolved and ended before devrel 
sought to take action. If they did not then, none of this would have existed.

I was banned from posting to -nfp. I made 1 post after that ban. I could have 
posted much more. I stopped, the problem ended. Days later devrel decided I 
needed to be suspended for 15 days for the 1 post. Despite nothing after that 
post and the matter having ended. They got involved when they needed not, took 
action beyond what they needed to resolve the issue, and the result has 
created a problem spanning ~8 years.
 
Same in 2015. I was proceeding with jlec, till others decided they need to 
participate and cause problems rather than be helpful.

> And by resolving I meant driving to a conclusion.  Ideally that
> conclusion is that people are behaving nicely.  However, a situation
> where somebody who does not demonstrate a change in behavior is
> removed is a resolution.

You cannot control peoples behavior. This is a volunteer project. The main 
goal is to continue to attract volunteers and keep the project moving forward 
technically.

If you seek harmony in this process. You are seeking something that will never 
be obtained, and the process of achieving such harmony will have its own 
consequences. Which could potentially effect things as a whole much worse than 
the original problem.

That has been the case with me. The problem created by devrel/comrel has set 
back Gentoo Java over 8 years, and also hurt the foundation regarding its IRS 
status. Neither is good for Gentoo. For any harm I may have brought to Gentoo 
since 2008. What if I brought more good than bad?

None the less, bad will always be there, Gentoo needs all the good, 
developers, manpower, and contributions it can get.

-- 
William L. Thomson Jr.