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On Thursday, January 5, 2017 8:46:32 AM EST Rich Freeman wrote: |
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> On Thu, Jan 5, 2017 at 8:15 AM, Paweł Hajdan, Jr. <phajdan.jr@g.o> |
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wrote: |
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> > By the way, now with git, why don't we change from quizzes to just |
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> > "submitted X high-quality PRs and got support from Z existing committers"? |
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> |
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> The quizzes cover a lot of organizational information that have |
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> nothing to do with writing ebuilds, like the very first one: "When is |
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> it appropriate to post to the following mailing lists: gentoo-core, |
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> gentoo-dev, gentoo-dev-announce, gentoo-project? Provide examples of |
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> topics that are appropriate for each one of them." |
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It is exactly that sort of stuff that causes issues for some. Why one of my |
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recruiting attempts took 2 hours on the 1st quiz and did not make it half way |
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through the 1st of 3 quizzes total. |
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From my attempt to return in 2011. Note the returning dev comment, 2010-12-21, |
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and nothing from recruiting for months. Then on 2011-03-09 |
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https://bugs.gentoo.org/show_bug.cgi?id=135927#c27 |
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Some may disagree with organizational information, list usage, etc. Some stuff |
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like list usage is not so controversial but could become such. Questions |
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relating to conflicts should not be part of quiz, IMHO. To much focus on |
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organizational stuff that is pretty moot. |
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Said another way, many do not care about Gentoo organizationally and not sure |
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it is crucial they know that stuff to contribute. |
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> Additionally the quiz covers a pretty broad variety of topics that |
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> just a few pull requests might not hit. Gentoo also doesn't use CI |
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> and tinderboxing/etc so it is important to make sure devs are aware |
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> that they need to run repoman on all commits/etc. |
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The Java Quiz is such, but many work on Java ebuilds never having taken that |
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technical quiz. It is a soft requirement for joining the team but not a hard. |
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> The quiz interaction is also intended to help the mentor get to know |
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> the applicant, and later for the recruiters to do the same. |
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I think the mentor should be getting to know the applicant in working with |
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them in general. Quiz review as a tool for recruiters to get to know someone |
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is HORRIBLE. |
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Someone may have contributed for a very long time. Recruiters may be much |
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newer, and their first interaction be during recruitment/quiz review. They will |
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not take the time to truly get to know someone. Though they will judge them on |
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their interaction as they are "qualifying" them socially and otherwise. |
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Recruiters should get to know recruits far in advance of a quiz. Recruiters |
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need to recruit, not just process quizzes as if they are HR. If recruiters |
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knew people, I feel the entire process would be much smoother and faster. |
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> There are |
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> certainly other ways of doing that, but I suspect they'd involve a |
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> similar amount of back and forth since the only way to get to know |
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> somebody is to interact with them. |
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Interaction is the only way. Not just once or twice, but over a period of |
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time. Or they should take the word of those who have interacted with them over |
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time. Mentoring developer, or other developers. |
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For many the only time they will interact with a recruiter is during quiz |
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review and such, and that is NOT a good way to get to know someone. |
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-- |
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William L. Thomson Jr. |
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