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On Sun, Feb 11, 2018 at 7:12 PM, William Hubbs <williamh@g.o> wrote: |
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> |
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>> Appeals sometimes reverse decisions because these lower groups are |
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>> imperfect at enacting the policies set at the top, or they are |
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>> operating in areas where no precedent exists. These reversals |
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>> shouldn't be seen as some kind of checks/balances system that adds |
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>> value, but an inefficiency that wastes time deliberating matters more |
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>> than once. It is necessary only because it would be even more |
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>> inefficient to slow everything down to a pace where one small group |
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>> could deal with it all. |
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> |
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> I agree that the higher body should not be involved in every case; |
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> However, I absolutely do not agree that appeals are not a |
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> checks/balances system. If someone appeals something it means that they |
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> feel that the decision made by the lower body needs to be re-examined. |
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> If the higher body then overrules the lower body, it isn't meant in a |
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> shameful way, it is just guidance for the lower body in the future. |
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|
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Checks and balances are when two bodies are allowed to be in |
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opposition, with neither body being superior to the other. In the US |
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system the three federal branches operate in this way for the most |
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part, with each branch able to block certain actions of the others. |
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|
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An appeal isn't a check and balance. An appeal is a superior body |
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having the opportunity to overrule the action of an inferior one. |
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Comrel doesn't act as a check against the Council, nor does the |
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Council really act as a check against Comrel. Council sets policies, |
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Comrel enforces them (with its own ability to set policy subordinate |
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to Council). |
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|
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> |
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>> So, if there were no QA or comrel, and there were just the council, |
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>> and it handled everything and there were no appeals at all, this would |
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>> not lower the quality of decisions, but it would actually raise them |
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>> (since some incorrect decisions might not be appealed). However, it |
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>> would come at a cost of a lot less stuff getting done since you'd have |
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>> reducing the pool of labor. |
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> |
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> Rich, I don't follow this logic at all. |
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What is confusing about it? Imagine that the Council dissolved both |
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QA and Comrel, and directly handled both? The main issue with this is |
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that stuff would probably get neglected, but ultimately it is the same |
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body that is making the final decisions. |
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|
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> I know about the appellate courts, but there are other levels as well. |
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> You would never find a district courte judge on an appellate court |
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> simultaneously, and you would never find an appellate court judge or |
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> district courte judge serving simultaneously as a justice on the Supreme Court. |
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|
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As far as I am aware there is no provision in US law that prevents |
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this. It is just impractical, and would defeat the point of |
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delegation. |
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|
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Keep in mind that real-world courts pay salaries and as a result tend |
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to have a surplus of qualified professionals to man every post. The |
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same is not true within Gentoo. |
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|
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In an ideal world we'd have more people to man these posts. |
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|
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As I recall there have been complaints made on the lists that the |
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leaders on the Council need to do more to fix problems actively vs |
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just waiting for people to come to them for decisions. I think this |
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is the main reason why Council members ended up in lead roles on other |
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projects. Some project was considered to need help, and a Council |
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member stepped into try to strengthen it. I'd be careful about |
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banning this sort of practice, because then the only thing the Council |
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could do if Comrel or QA were inactive would be to whine about it on |
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the lists until somebody else stepped up to fix things. |
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In any case, that's my opinion. I suspect it might not be a majority |
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opinion and that is OK. The world won't end if a few more critical |
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Gentoo projects go idle... |
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|
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-- |
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Rich |