Re: [gentoo-project] Gentoo Social Contract, Council: please fix the mess you cause

[Matthew Thode]

On 18-03-25 19:55:22, Daniel Robbins wrote:
> Hey klondike,
>
> I am looking at the social contract and the only place that
> gentoo-dev@l.g.o is in the introductory paragraph:
>
> "This social contract is intended to clearly describe the overall
> development policies and standards of the Gentoo project development team.
> Parts of this document have been derived from the Debian Social Contract.
> It is generally very similar to it except that certain parts have been
> clarified and augmented while other parts deemed redundant have been
> removed. Comments are welcome. Please send them to our
> gentoo-dev@l.g.o mailing list."
>
> It's not actually in the social contract itself.
>
> At one point, maybe these last three sentences of the intro paragraph were
> appropriate, like when the social contract was a new thing and more of a
> work in progress.
>
> I would recommend the following changes. Replace the last three sentences
> of the introductory paragraph with something similar to the following:
>
> "Potential improvements to the social contract should be submitted to the
> Gentoo Linux bug tracker at https://bugs.funtoo.org, and assigned to

s/funtoo/gentoo
:P  Other than that it looks good though

> gentoo-trustees. Specific questions about social contract, and discussion
> about potential future improvements can be posted to the gentoo-project
> mailing list."
>
> This is fair. First, it removes an attribution to Debian. I think our
> social contract has evolved to the point where it's now its own thing?
> (Maybe I'm wrong on this point) And it tightens up the wording to make it
> clear that our social contract is not in a "hey -- tell us what you think"
> stage. And yet we do have a clear process for formal changes (bug tracker)
> and general discussion and questions (gentoo-project).
>
> -Daniel
>
> On Sun, Mar 25, 2018 at 6:40 PM, Francisco Blas Izquierdo Riera (klondike) <
> klondike@g.o> wrote:
>
> > Dear Gentoo Council,
> >
> > During the meeting you held on December (see the logs here:
> > https://projects.gentoo.org/council/meeting-logs/20171210.txt ), you
> > voted for restricting the gentoo-dev mailing list. Although in said meeting
> > somebody raised that such a change affected the Gentoo Social Contract as
> > it referred users to provide comments on the gentoo-dev mailing list (see
> > https://www.gentoo.org/get-started/philosophy/social-contract.html ) this
> > was dismissed by one of your members (which has, in the past, called the
> > Gentoo Social Contract "dead law") by saying that the right place to send
> > such comments is gentoo-project (but willingly ignoring that such a
> > reference has been part of it since the first archived draft version
> > https://web.archive.org/web/20021112053724/http://www.
> > gentoo.org:80/main/en/contract.xml and the first non draft version
> > https://web.archive.org/web/20031203222653/http://www.
> > gentoo.org:80/main/en/contract.xml which predate the gentoo-project
> > mailing list) and apparently ignored by the rest.
> >
> > This was noted after the vote had happened and to the best of my knowledge
> > hadn't been raised before. Despite that, on the next meeting where the
> > topic was discussed a different council member stated that said person did
> > not "any pertinent new information since last vote".
> >
> > Now, three months after, no action has been carried by the council on this
> > very specific regard despite being made aware of it. This clearly shows
> > that the current council members not only take hastened decissions without
> > even doing propper research, they don't try to clean up the mess they cause
> > after their own decissions.
> >
> > Given the inaction by the council, I'm propossing to apply either of these
> > two changes to the Gentoo Social contract.
> >
> > First propossal:
> > Replace "Comments are welcome. Please send them to our
> > gentoo-dev@l.g.o mailing list." by "Comments by selected
> > people are welcome. Please send them to our gentoo-dev@l.g.o
> > mailing list.". Which clearly reflects the new ivory tower philosophy the
> > Council is making the Gentoo Project take.
> >
> > Second propossal:
> > Replace "Comments are welcome. Please send them to our
> > gentoo-dev@l.g.o mailing list." by "Comments by selected
> > people are welcome. Please send them to our gentoo-project@lists.
> > gentoo.org mailing list CCing the Gentoo Foundation trustees on
> > trustees@l.g.o.". Which ensures trustees get a notification of
> > such propossals and still keeps the social contract open to comments for
> > anybody.
> >
> > Please note, in the spirit of the second propossal I'm CCing
> > gentoo-project.
> >
> > Klondike
> >

-- 
Matthew Thode (prometheanfire)