Re: [gentoo-user] Should we NEVER do an ``emerge -u world''?

[Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.]

On Wednesday 27 September 2006 13:04, sdoma <sdoma@××××××××.cz> wrote 
about 'Re: [gentoo-user] Should we NEVER do an ``emerge -u world''?':
> I've tried to get documentoin for Tcl/tk, put 'doc' into the package.use
> for these files and re-emerged tcl and tk (BTW: no docs for these
> packages came up).

What do you mean came up?  The doc USE-flag doesn't add to the output of 
the emerge (generally) and certainly isn't going to open some window with 
documentation in it!  You can use equery to see what files a package 
installed but, generally, docs are installed to /usr/share/docs

> emerge told me, that there is a new version of
> portage available and that it is HIGHLY recommended to upgrade portage.
> I did so and 87 packages where upgraded

So, you think "upgrade portage" means to execute "emerge -u world"?  That's 
wrong, and you would have known that if you'd have read the documentation.

> amongst this glibc to 2.4, what
> hurts me now because I planned to install Oracle, which requires
> glibc2.3.

Well, emerge does provide -p (--pretend) and -a (--ask) options so that you 
can see what changes it suggests.  Portage also 
reads /etc/portage/package.mask to determine your local preferences for 
what not to install.

> Seems x86 or ~x86 doesn't make much a difference. I reinstalled the
> system not so long ago with x86 fo this reason.

That true, with the new gcc being stable, the new glibc has become stable.  
~x86 got this upgrade before x86, but even x86 gets upgrades from time to 
time.

> I remember the same problems a couple of times in the past. /etc/fstab
> was "upgraded" to the initial one (the one with /dev/BOOT and dev/ROOT
> inside resulting in a not booting system),

By, default that file in is a CONFIG_PROTECT-ed directory, which means 
portage will not overwrite it.

You have either (a) CONFIG_PROTECT_MASK-ed that directory (a horrible idea) 
or (b) explicitly *told* etc-update, dispatch-conf, or some other 
configuration file management tool to replace your old version; that tool 
just did what you told it to.

> networking stopped working
> letting me on my own, stopping hotplug (and historical
> coldplug-nonsense) functionality, udev.rules where replaced by some
> initial one for a syntax change in udev

All of these sound like you made some mistake when managing your 
configuration files.  Perhaps by using the -5 option in etc-update, an 
almost universally bad idea.  It is available because it might be useful 
to people who read the documentation.

> Just a minor thing, before I realized the USB problem, I was working on
> 'localhost:unknown-domain' after the "upgrade".

Again, sounds like a run with etc-update, although it might be related to 
some of the changes in how your hostname and domainname are set.

> I'm really sick of solving the same problems again and again. Seems
> Gentoo is a system for students not needing their comps to be working.

Odd.  I've been running testing (~ARCH) Gentoo since the 2004.3 release, 
and I don't get that impression.  There are some things that need to be 
fixed.  The way package configuration is done is not one of them.

> For me it looks at this point like: "Every other distribution is a
> better choice for somebody who needs his machine for work". I don't like
> to say that, but this is my expirience. :(

I'm sorry your Gentoo doesn't work the way you expect right now.  If you'd 
like, I can help your fix your issues, although it may take some time, and 
it will definitely both effort and care on your part. Hopefully, we'll 
also learn how to prevent those issues from reoccurring.

We might even find things Gentoo can do better, but be prepared to defend 
any proposed changes and also realize that all the developers are 
volunteers so no one can force them to implement any change.

> PS: X-cuse me top-posting. This is a really exportant issue, and I'm
> disturbing it. ;-(

I'm not sure what this is supposed to mean, but when using your mailer 
(Evolution, I think) there's no excuse for top-posting.

> PS 2: Co work with LFS! They have the same target (get people to know
> the functionality of Linux).

That's not Gentoo's goal.  Gentoo's goal (if there is a single goal) is to 
be a tool instead of a mindset.  Do do what you want and get out of the 
way.

> I'll install some working distro which is
> conform with other POSIX compliant systems

Like Gentoo?

-- 
"If there's one thing we've established over the years,
it's that the vast majority of our users don't have the slightest
clue what's best for them in terms of package stability."
-- Gentoo Developer Ciaran McCreesh