Re: [gentoo-user] want to upgrade 50 month old installation

[Dale]

Alan McKinnon wrote:
> On 05/08/2015 05:28, Felix Miata wrote:
>>> If we (gentoo) had a simple installation semantic, this sort of problem
>>>> would most likely disappear; so the wider community could delve into other
>>>> technical support issues...... YMMV.
>> I get the feeling Gentoo isn't a right choice for people who need a "simple
>> installation semantic".
>
> Bingo.
>
> People keep trying to dumb Gentoo down and make it somehow automagic.
>
> These people uniformly do not understand the entire Gentoo landscape.
>
> Here's what binary distros do:
>
> A bunch of dudes decide how the thing will be built. They make choices.
> A bunch of maintainers decide how their package will be built and what
> it will do. They make choices.
> Both groups give their choices to you. If you do not like their choices,
> use a different distro.
> By making choices and mostly casting them in stone, these maintainers
> have swapped the ability to have anything you want and replace it with
> ease of use (or lack of having to think about detail).
>
> Here's how Gentoo works:
>
> All of the above, you do yourself. You assume the entire responsibility
> that distro devs take, and you take it all upon yourself, the whole damn
> lot. Gentoo devs do make choices, but this process is not in any way
> comparable to what binary distros do. In Gentoo, a dev's choice is a
> reasonable default, you always have the option to do it your way (and
> keep all the tiny pieces when it shatters)
>
>
>
> It should be more obvious now why "simple installation semantic" is a
> total oxymoron in a Gentoo setting. It is a) anything but simple and b)
> your vast array of choices (limited only by what upstream sources can be
> configured to do) blow any idea of a consistent framework out of the water.
>
> The best you will do with a Gentoo install semantic is satisfy a clearly
> defined sub-set of Gentoo users.
>
> Put another way and using a car analogy:
>
> Fedora gives you an off the floor model from a dealer, complete with
> lots of options like auto/manual or aircon or optional electric mirrors.
>
> Gentoo is a kit car, with the option of not even having a body mould if
> you don't want one. Want to design and make it all yourself? Yeah you
> can do that. Want to rather make a beach buggy that someone else did the
> work on, re-use their work so you can concentrate only on the paint
> detail? Yeah, that is supported to.
>
> Every time I hear the words "simple" or "just" in a Gentoo context, I
> have to suppress a laugh :-)
>
>

+1

I still recall the last time Gentoo had a installer.  The biggest change
I saw was people coming on the forums, this mailing list and a few other
places asking questions that had they done a regular install, they would
have already known the answer to.  As I have said before several times,
the install process teaches a LOT about how Gentoo works and also gives
a basis for how to maintain it as well.  If they do another installer,
we will see the same thing again.  People that use that installer will
find that they have to actually know how Gentoo works to maintain their
install.  After running into some problems a few times, they end up
moving on because they find Gentoo to hard to work with. 

Gentoo is not your ordinary distro.  It is unique for sure. 

Dale

:-)  :-)