Gentoo Archives: gentoo-user

To: gentoo-user@l.g.o
Subject: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Is gnome becoming obligatory?
Date: Mon, 11 Dec 2017 13:22:54
In Reply to: Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Is gnome becoming obligatory? by Mick
1 (a good madscientist)
2 --
5 11. Dec 2017 05:39 by michaelkintzios@×××××.com:
8 > On Monday, 11 December 2017 11:59:03 GMT Jorge Almeida wrote:
9 >> On Sun, Dec 10, 2017 at 7:31 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés <>> caneko@×××××.com>> >
10 > wrote:
11 >
12 >> > Just my two cents. I will not answer any reply to my little contribution
13 >> > to
14 >> > this thread;
15 >>
16 >> Good. I can't remember any intervention from you that I would miss. Of
17 >> course, I wouldn't dream of telling people how they should think, nor
18 >> would I deny anyone the right to be an activist.
19 >>
20 >> > Enjoy your echo chamber.
21 >>
22 >> Thank you for your contribution, Dr. Yes, we know you're a Dr. We know
23 >> it because:
24 >
25 > Crikey! I didn't expect my question to trigger yet another thread of 'systemd
26 > Vs freedom of choice (non-systemd)' arguments. Dr. Canek has been an advocate
27 > of systemd for years now and has posted his views on this topic more than
28 > once. He has tried hard to make gentoo users see the light in the superiority
29 > of systemd and put his arguments across. He has also done a lot of
30 > development work to establish systemd in Gentoo. His views are somewhat
31 > parochial - only those who (can) code have an influence if not a right to
32 > determine the direction of travel - I paraphrase of course. There is truth in
33 > this and anyone can recognise that money can buy developer hours and direct
34 > their development effort.
35 >
36 > The facts remain that RHL and their employees have shaped the Linux eco-system
37 > to suit their business interests; spinning predictably and reliably thousands
38 > of identical VMs in data centres. The MSWindows monolithic stack architecture
39 > is something they wanted/needed and this is what they developed.
40 >
41 > <snip>
42 > Just my 2c's.
43 > --
44 > Regards,
45 > Mick
50 interestingly, RH (and Centos) have both dumped systemd and gone to another system (I don't remember which one).  In fact they've done so retroactively on earlier versions.  Of course the continuing take over of linux by commercial interest is distorting development goals (time spent trying to destandardize/create new standards, make it harder to install and maintain, and new tools they don't have to give away). 
56 It's really sad that people accepted an open source license and built a business for decades, and now   are now doing their best to keep free users out, way out of the loop (to the extent they can without technically violated the license).  It's really sad because these companies are all making good money (which is fine) but like many of the rich (not all) they want more $$ and are willing to be rather dishonorable about it.  It's a bad time for linux in many ways.  Personally, like Linus himself, I'm looking for the next free os. 
62 Do to it's long history and many, many donated hours,  design by  groups, and resulting complexity it's very hard to fix some of the incorrect/suboptimal decisions that are deep down, and most developers want to work on something new (not old and complicated like securing X).  Don't get me wrong, I love linux, but I'll also be learning bsd and looking for such a project.  Operating systems are big clumsy beast that require an incredible amount of work to realize and then maintain, but some are still willing to do such work for free/fun (I hope to know enough to help in a couple of years, I'm good at programing but i'll need to do better/more correct work consistent with good style and design and learn a lot about real/ideal operating systems and the inevitable trade offs).
67 Then there are the promoters of questionable tech/implementations, many as dishonest and childish as some of our politicians, and like many politicians it's become more of a sales game, with people making up data, lying, and generally disrespecting their' users.  A strategy that can work for awhile, until they've converted their' good reputation into a fast buck (most of the big companies are doing it, triplite for example, once commercial grade and well respected, but now sellers of sub-consumer grade gear). 
73 And for embeded applications systemd is nothing but a liability, forcing dev tools and a server onto a router etc. just opens up new vulnerabilities for basicly nothing (other than a graphical interface server that very limited).   The main thing i love about linux is choice, you can use the cool edgy stuff that's still buggy or the more stable or both depending on your' mood and goal.  Your mileage will vary.


Subject Author
Re: [gentoo-user] Re: Is gnome becoming obligatory? Richard Bradfield <bradfier@×××××.me>