Re: [gentoo-user] Systemd upower

[Samuli Suominen]

On 04/06/14 15:21, Tanstaafl wrote:
> On 6/3/2014 1:08 PM, Canek Peláez Valdés <caneko@×××××.com> wrote:
>> On Tue, Jun 3, 2014 at 11:48 AM, Tanstaafl
>> <tanstaafl@×××××××××××.org> wrote:
>>> On 6/3/2014 11:10 AM, Canek Peláez Valdés <caneko@×××××.com> wrote:
>>>> Maybe. The thing is, this is going to keep happening, as more and more
>>>> infrastructure migrates towards systemd. Perhaps a news item everytime
>>>> it happens is unrealistic?
>
>>> Weren't you the one saying that those of us who were voicing
>>> concerns that
>>> systemd proponents were ultimately wanting to FORCE systemd on
>>> everyone were
>>> just scare-mongering conspiracy theorists?
>
>> Who is "forcing"  anything?
>
> I was specifically referring to your comment that:
>
>> The thing is, this is going to keep happening, as more and more
>> infrastructure migrates towards systemd.
>
> That comment right there - specifically the word *infrastructure* -
> screams to me 'we intend to take over the world'.
>
> And yes, as devs get lazier (decide to rely on systemd rather than
> build it to work independently of the init system), this will in fact
> result in *users* (read: those lacking the skills to code every
> program out there to work without systemd) eventually being *forced*
> to switch to systemd.

You can still install GNOME without systemd from Portage using the
USE="openrc-force" (which needs to be unmasked using
/etc/portage/profile/use.mask line like
-openrc-force)

And nobody is ever forced to do anything within Open Source, you always
have the option to contibute code, or donate money to get someone
else contribute the code

Calling volunteers who work without paycheck lazy is just bad behavior

>
> That is simply the reality. You can ignore it if you like, but it
> doesn't change it. Forced is forced.
>
>> That's what you and many others don't seem to understand: systemd is a
>> *BETTER* implementation for basically *ALL* the hodgepodge of
>> "solutions" that we had before in our plumbing layer.
>
> Time will tell, and you may even be right. The problem is, average
> users really don't have a way to prove this to themselves, all we see
> is the wailing and gnashing of teeth as stuff constantly *breaks* that
> *never* broke before.
>

Nothing has been broken so far yet. People are just facing hard
realities and noticing some packages have been abandoned for years, even
before systemd became popular as it is now. You can't blame systemd,
upower, and other developers for ditching such outdated code and
using what they like as they code it for their application.

- Samuli