Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: How To Play WMV (thread drift - slaveryware)

[Boyd Stephen Smith Jr.]

On Thursday 28 September 2006 13:16, "Bob Young" <BYoung@××××××××××.com> 
wrote about 'RE: [gentoo-amd64]  Re: How To Play WMV (thread drift - 
slaveryware)':
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: news [mailto:news@×××××××××.org]On Behalf Of Duncan
> > Sent: Thursday, September 28, 2006 3:27 AM
> > To: gentoo-amd64@l.g.o
> > Subject: [gentoo-amd64] Re: How To Play WMV?
> >
> > I didn't
> > switch to Linux after a decade on slaveryware just to be enslaved by a
> > different master, and enslaved it is,
>
> Not really, *most* people will be, just as "enslaved" even if they do
> use a GPLed version of the software.

Not true.  The freedom to modify the code is important even if the user 
cannot directly exert it, because it allows the user to pay someone *other 
than the copyright holder* to do the modifications for them.

Also, anyone is allowed to give their friend free software and to use free 
software for any purpose.  Those freedoms are not provided to users of 
non-free software.

> > when the lack of ATI and NVidia
> > drivers is the only reason xorg-7.1 is not yet stable on x86 or amd64,
> > and it's the same thing with other distributions -- their actions are
> > holding a large segment of the would-be free software world hostage.
> > Call it what you like, I call choosing to be a hostage to the whims of
> > a software overlord choosing to be enslaved, and I both refuse to do
> > it, and refuse to have my money go toward funding the slave-masters!
>
> How is that different from people who can't read code being at the whims
> of Linux kernel developers?

No one is at the whims of the kernel developers.  Even if you can't read 
code, you can communicate with people *other than the kernel developers* 
who can read code.  You aren't forced to trust the kernel developers word 
that patch X is "better" for linux.  Sure, it may improve performance in 
90% of the cases -- but what if you are in the other 10%?  Even if you 
don't understand code, it's simple enough to reverse a patch.

> The fact is, that's a weak argument at best,

I call BS.

> it's valid for a very small
> group of people, namely programmers. Everyone else, even if they use
> "freedomware," has to depend on *someone else* to fix/modify/update the
> app/utility/driver.

Yes, they might have to contact someone else.  But, the are forced to send 
all changes through *one particular entity*.  They can make their own 
choices on how the software they use is modified.  Remember, free (libre) 
software isn't free (gratis).  The production (and maintenance) of 
software has a cost and not matter how you license it you *can't* make 
that cost go away.

> I fail to see that it really makes much of a difference whether Jane
> Avgusr is dependent on a Linux kernel developer or on an engineer
> working at nVidia.

Because *no one* is dependent on the linux kernel developers.  You can make 
the needed changes.  If you don't have the ability to, you can get someone 
else to using other resources available to you.  E.g. I really need my 
lawn mowed and I hate doing it; I'll trade you a mowed lawn for a kernel 
patch.

Someone *has* to pay for the cost of maintaining and improving software. 
That's economic fact.  NVidia says you have to pay *them* to improve their 
software.  Linux kernel developers says you can pay *anyone with the 
skills* (or use your own time) to improve the software.  Clearly, you have 
more options (and are thus more free) with free software.

> There really is no such thing as "slaveryware" or "freedomware" it's all

Yes, there very well is.  I want software I'm free to distribute (I need 
freedomware).  I want software I'm free to use how I see fit (I need 
freedom ware).  I want software I can profile and audit myself

> just software, and anyone who doesn't read/write code, which is the vast
> majority of the population by the way, is dependent (i.e. "enslaved" by
> RS's terminology) on someone else, who that someone else is, doesn't
> really make much difference in terms of the dynamics of the
> relationship.

Analogy:
improving and maintaining software = food
software companies and individual developers = farms and farmers

So, you are saying it "doesn't make much different" whether I'm forced to 
buy all my food from one particular farm or if I'm allowed to buy food 
from any farmer (probably on the free market)?

The fact is that is DOES matter.  And anyone that doesn't understand that 
is simplifying things to much.

-- 
"If there's one thing we've established over the years,
it's that the vast majority of our users don't have the slightest
clue what's best for them in terms of package stability."
-- Gentoo Developer Ciaran McCreesh