1 |
On Thu, 15 Jun 2017 17:59:13 +0200 |
2 |
Michał Górny <mgorny@g.o> wrote: |
3 |
|
4 |
> On śro, 2017-06-14 at 16:09 +0200, Alexis Ballier wrote: |
5 |
> > On Wed, 14 Jun 2017 15:57:38 +0200 |
6 |
> > Michał Górny <mgorny@g.o> wrote: |
7 |
> > [...] |
8 |
> > > > [...] |
9 |
> > > > > > > > > [1]:https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/User:MGorny/GLEP:ReqUse |
10 |
> > > > > > > > |
11 |
> > > > > > > > I really don't like the reordering thing. Even the |
12 |
> > > > > > > > restricted syntax does not fix the issue with '^^ ( a b |
13 |
> > > > > > > > ) b? ( a )' already mentioned here. It'd be much better |
14 |
> > > > > > > > and simpler for the spec just to assign a fixed value |
15 |
> > > > > > > > and use the solving rules with those. |
16 |
> > > > > > > |
17 |
> > > > > > > You're not going to convince me by providing examples |
18 |
> > > > > > > that are utterly broken by design and |
19 |
> > > > > > > meaningless ;-). |
20 |
> > > > > > |
21 |
> > > > > > Well... if it's so obvious that the example is broken by |
22 |
> > > > > > design that you don't even bother to explain why, I assume |
23 |
> > > > > > you have an algorithm for that. Where is the code ? What |
24 |
> > > > > > are the numbers ? How many ebuilds might fail after |
25 |
> > > > > > reordering ? How can this be improved ? |
26 |
> > > > > |
27 |
> > > > > Are you arguing for the sake of arguing here? I just presumed |
28 |
> > > > > that this example is so obviously broken there is no point |
29 |
> > > > > wasting any more time on it. The code of nsolve clearly |
30 |
> > > > > detects that, so I don't really understand what you're trying |
31 |
> > > > > to prove here. |
32 |
> > > > |
33 |
> > > > Those are real questions. You should take breath, think a bit |
34 |
> > > > about it, and try to run the 2 possible orderings of the ^^ |
35 |
> > > > through nsolve or even solve.py. They both are very happy (and |
36 |
> > > > are right to be) with the above ordering. You might want to |
37 |
> > > > think a bit more about what is the relation between this broken |
38 |
> > > > 10 chars example and the 10 lines python targets one below. |
39 |
> > > > |
40 |
> > > > You should also realize that all the above questions have |
41 |
> > > > already been answered in length if you do as I suggest. |
42 |
> > > |
43 |
> > > No. I have already spent too much time on this. We're already long |
44 |
> > > past all useful use cases, and now I feel like you're going to |
45 |
> > > argue to death just to find a perfect algorithm that supports |
46 |
> > > every absurd construct anyone can even write, if only to figure |
47 |
> > > out the construct is completely useless. |
48 |
> > |
49 |
> > I'm not going to argue to death. It's already proven reordering is |
50 |
> > broken. |
51 |
> > |
52 |
> > > If you want to play with it more, then please by all means do |
53 |
> > > so. |
54 |
> > |
55 |
> > There is nothing to do for reordering. It's broken by design. |
56 |
> > |
57 |
> > > However, do not expect me to waste any more of my time on it. I've |
58 |
> > > done my part, the code works for all reasonable use cases and |
59 |
> > > solves all the problems I needed solving. If you want more, then |
60 |
> > > it's your job to do it and solve the resulting issues. |
61 |
> > |
62 |
> > Like... writing code handling all the cases and describing how it |
63 |
> > works ? We're past that. The only thing we're not past is that you |
64 |
> > fail to understand it and attempt to block it. |
65 |
> > |
66 |
> |
67 |
> Then please provide a single valid example that: |
68 |
|
69 |
app-text/wklej-0.2.1-r1 ^^ ( python_single_target_pypy |
70 |
python_single_target_pypy3 python_single_target_python2_7 |
71 |
python_single_target_python3_4 python_single_target_python3_5 |
72 |
python_single_target_python3_6 ) python_single_target_pypy? |
73 |
( python_targets_pypy ) python_single_target_pypy3? |
74 |
( python_targets_pypy3 ) python_single_target_python2_7? |
75 |
( python_targets_python2_7 ) python_single_target_python3_4? |
76 |
( python_targets_python3_4 ) python_single_target_python3_5? |
77 |
( python_targets_python3_5 ) python_single_target_python3_6? |
78 |
( python_targets_python3_6 ) vim? ( ^^ ( python_single_target_python2_7 |
79 |
) ) |
80 |
|
81 |
|
82 |
Simplified as: |
83 |
^^ ( a b ) c? ( b ) |
84 |
|
85 |
(see the pattern now ? :) ) |
86 |
|
87 |
> a. is completely 'correct' (that is, provides a valid, predictable |
88 |
> and acceptable solution) with the default ordering O_a, |
89 |
|
90 |
c? ( b ) ^^ ( b a ) |
91 |
|
92 |
|
93 |
> b. is not 'correct' with at least one reordering O_b (assuming only |
94 |
> ||, ^^, ?? is subject to reordering), |
95 |
|
96 |
c? ( b ) ^^ ( a b ) |
97 |
|
98 |
> |
99 |
> c. nsolve reports O_a as all good, and O_b as not good. |
100 |
|
101 |
I'll let you run this. It does. |
102 |
|
103 |
> The best way to convince me is through valid examples. |
104 |
|
105 |
|
106 |
It is also easier to be convinced when you try to understand and ask |
107 |
for clarifications instead of just rejecting without thinking :) |
108 |
|
109 |
Alexis. |