1 |
On Thu, 2006-01-05 at 04:31 +0000, Kurt Lieber wrote: |
2 |
> On Wed, Jan 04, 2006 at 07:57:06PM -0800 or thereabouts, Greg KH wrote: |
3 |
> > > Which is why Gentoo has jumped the shark and is now on a long, slow |
4 |
> > > decline. |
5 |
> > |
6 |
> > Ok, then what should Gentoo do to fix this percieved decline? |
7 |
> |
8 |
> Exactly what a lot of folks will have kittens about; appoint a CEO, leader, |
9 |
> boss, manager, etc. (you know, all those corporate-type words that raise |
10 |
> the hackles of nearly everyone on this list.) |
11 |
|
12 |
You mean the same thing that we *had* that caused the loss of quite a |
13 |
few good developers and drove many people away from Gentoo before they |
14 |
ever even learned of its values. Sounds like an excellent plan. |
15 |
|
16 |
> Right now, Gentoo is this gigantic, obese amoeba that just sort of sits in |
17 |
> one place. Different parts of it try to go in different directions, with |
18 |
> the net result being that the whole body never goes anywhere. We haven't |
19 |
> done anything interesting or innovative over the last...year? two years? |
20 |
> We have no effective leadership whatsoever. We spend far too much time |
21 |
> arguing amongst ourselves instead of working as a team towards a common |
22 |
> goal. |
23 |
|
24 |
This is what I don't get. So what if Gentoo is an amoeba? Does it |
25 |
really matter? Would you rather that we dropped Gentoo/ALT, Hardened, |
26 |
Embedded, and anything else interesting just so we can focus on a "core |
27 |
technology" of some sort? Remember that we are not out to make money. |
28 |
We are a not-for-profit for a reason. We don't have to answer to |
29 |
investors and shareholders. |
30 |
|
31 |
Another thing that I see people fail to really comprehend is what |
32 |
exactly "interesting and innovative" can we do? I would have thought |
33 |
that the introduction of our Gentoo Linux Installer would qualify. What |
34 |
about the Hardened LiveCD? Gentoo's Knoppix-style CD? All of the |
35 |
working going into Gentoo for Mac OS X and Gentoo/BSD? The extension of |
36 |
the embedded/uclibc stuff to many more architectures? |
37 |
|
38 |
It seems as if just because something doesn't tickle the fancy of the |
39 |
Linux World Expo corporate types it isn't important. |
40 |
|
41 |
> We should appoint one person to lead the project. Make sure that person |
42 |
> knows WTF they're doing, are respected by the right developers, has a good |
43 |
> vision for Gentoo and then let them make decisions. Expect people to |
44 |
> adhere to the decisions and, if they don't, invite them to find other |
45 |
> opportunities for their creative outlet. |
46 |
|
47 |
Fine. I vote for vapier. So next time he tells you to touch his wang, |
48 |
you better damn well listen. ;] |
49 |
|
50 |
> That person should figure out what Gentoo wants to be when it grows up. |
51 |
|
52 |
Gentoo doesn't want to be anything. Gentoo is not a thing. Gentoo is a |
53 |
*collection* of over 300 individuals. We are not some corporate entity |
54 |
where individualism is destroyed for the corporate party line. |
55 |
|
56 |
Honestly, it sounds to me like that is what you want. |
57 |
|
58 |
I welcome you to fork Gentoo to do this. I'll be glad to assist you in |
59 |
any way that I can without giving up my ideas for where I want to take |
60 |
my projects within Gentoo. I respect that you should do the same, |
61 |
rather than hijack the distribution as a whole for your own purposes. |
62 |
|
63 |
> S/he should carefully consult the various stakeholders, look at the |
64 |
> strengths/weaknesses of Gentoo as it stands currently and then figure out |
65 |
> where the best direction is for it to proceed. They should then be |
66 |
> responsible for making sure everyone (and I mean *everyone*) executes |
67 |
> according to this direction. Folks who disagree with the vision will be |
68 |
> able to go their own direction and start their own projects. That's the |
69 |
> beauty of the GPL. |
70 |
|
71 |
So booting developers that have a technical reason for doing something |
72 |
different should be the norm? |
73 |
|
74 |
> Anyway, I have no illusions of this idea ever being implemented in the |
75 |
> current Gentoo environment. /shrug. It was a good ride. |
76 |
|
77 |
I'm glad to hear that. It really sounds like you are interested in |
78 |
turning Gentoo into some worthless shell of what it is currently. Sure, |
79 |
it'll have "added value" and "perceived worth" to the corporate drones, |
80 |
but any room for innovation and creativity will have been completely |
81 |
stifled by group think and yes men. Using your own example, you and |
82 |
anyone willing to work under such conditions are more than welcome to |
83 |
fork Gentoo. After all, you can use all of our work as you wish. |
84 |
That's the beauty of the GPL. |
85 |
|
86 |
-- |
87 |
Chris Gianelloni |
88 |
Release Engineering - Strategic Lead |
89 |
x86 Architecture Team |
90 |
Games - Developer |
91 |
Gentoo Linux |
92 |
|
93 |
-- |
94 |
gentoo-dev@g.o mailing list |