Gentoo Archives: gentoo-nfp

From: Rich Freeman <rich0@g.o>
To: gentoo-nfp <gentoo-nfp@l.g.o>
Subject: Re: [gentoo-nfp] Gentoo Social Contract and potential liabilities
Date: Sat, 24 Oct 2015 13:18:06
Message-Id: CAGfcS_m+4c+UFS=JzWXsE-VZHfJeYpq2w-VM82=8=oLU1qdP3w@mail.gmail.com
In Reply to: [gentoo-nfp] Gentoo Social Contract and potential liabilities by Sven Vermeulen
1 On Sat, Oct 24, 2015 at 8:33 AM, Sven Vermeulen <swift@g.o> wrote:
2 >
3 > This was brought forward when we started accepting user contributions
4 > through GitHub. Yes, we've had the discussion that we don't depend on it.
5 > But now the question was how do we need to interpret "depend on"?
6 >
7
8 The Council took up this topic last week. I'm not suggesting the
9 Trustees are bound by this, but they certainly should be informed by
10 it. What we agreed upon was:
11
12 "The Gentoo council encourages contributions to Gentoo via manyfold
13 ways. However, it also recognizes that the usage of Github, being a
14 closed-source service, poses the danger of data lock-in and should not
15 be preferred. The question has been posed whether the current usage of
16 Github is in line with the Gentoo social contract- a question still
17 open to interpretation.
18 With this background the council asks for implementation of
19 * the two-way mirroring of Github pull requests to bugzilla (including
20 comments and patches)
21 * the public archiving of Github repository e-mail notifications
22 * and the mirroring of Github pull request git branches on Gentoo
23 infrastructure
24 or functionally equivalent alternatives. The council believes that
25 this should suffice for all developers to dispell doubts about
26 adherence to the Gentoo social contract."
27
28 There is another side to this discussion which hasn't really been
29 touched upon. Even if we wanted to move away from Github, what could
30 we actually do to prevent its use? I think that attempting to do so
31 would be fairly divisive. You can't tell somebody what tools they can
32 use to prepare their patches any more than you can tell them what text
33 editor to use to author their ebuilds. A file that spent some time in
34 Github looks the same to Gentoo as a file that did not. I don't think
35 anybody is going to support kicking devs who use it, or even those who
36 encourage its use for contributions.
37
38 Likewise, we don't actually have a policy that forces devs to close
39 bugs at all, so a dev could choose to only work on pull requests
40 submitted in Github and ignore bugs in Bugzilla. I think that would
41 be ridiculous and counter-productive, but strictly speaking it would
42 be allowed by policy. And what is the alternative, forcing devs to
43 close Bugzilla bugs in a certain time? We don't require such things
44 because devs are volunteers and a dev closing two bugs is more useful
45 to us than a dev who quits and closes zero bugs because he's being
46 yelled at for not fixing twenty.
47
48 I think we'll get further by encouraging collaboration however it
49 happens. When I fix a bug in an openrc script it isn't because I
50 personally benefit (I no longer use openrc), but rather because it
51 usually isn't hard for me to do and I know that lots of others will
52 benefit. So, when you get a bug reported in an unconventional way, by
53 all means we should work to get it into Bugzilla, but we should be
54 fixing bugs because they're bugs, not because of how they're reported.
55
56 >
57 > In the extreme case, could developers and users who contributed time and
58 > effort to the Gentoo project ask for compensation the moment that we would
59 > be in breach of the Social Contract?
60 >
61
62 Under the present system, I'd think no, because all the real
63 contributions are licensed GPL-2+ which doesn't actually contain any
64 of our social contract terms. If we accumulated some big war chest of
65 donations and then used them contrary to our announced purposes, that
66 might be grounds for a lawsuit. However, we're not spending any
67 Foundation money on services like Github, and it seems unlikely that
68 we'd ever choose to do so, precisely because of the social contract.
69 While I think we shouldn't be opposed to developers using Github we
70 shouldn't be funding it.
71
72 I actually have suggested that Gentoo move towards something like the
73 FSFe FLA for copyright, and that does actually contain some clauses
74 for taking back contributions if Gentoo were to stray. However, that
75 is targeted more at re-licensing. For example, if you gave Gentoo an
76 exclusive license to your contribution under the FLA and Gentoo chose
77 to re-license it under a proprietary license, then the license would
78 be terminated and copyright would revert to you. However, even that
79 approach doesn't cover the social contract, and Gentoo would still
80 have the same rights towards contributed code as it has under the GPL.
81
82 IMO, trying to build stuff like this into actual software licenses is
83 unwise. As we can see there is a lot of debate over just what "depend
84 on" means and that isn't really a good foundation for a legal
85 document. I think the debate is healthy, but taking this into courts
86 and bankrupting the Foundation over the issue is not.
87
88 > So the second question is, what are the ramifications towards the Gentoo
89 > community, Gentoo project and even Gentoo Foundation when Gentoo would be in
90 > breach of this part of the Social Contract?
91
92 I think the Social Contract is more about what we stand for. Unless
93 we were to take this to an extreme, I doubt any court would want to
94 touch it from a legal perspective.
95
96 I think the real impact is that the Social Contract is a big part of
97 what brings us together. If we completely disregard it, I suspect
98 we'd see a lot of people drifting away. After all, we're all donating
99 our time. We want to donate that time towards something that means
100 something. So, the Social Contract is critically important to Gentoo
101 regardless of whether it has any legal basis.
102
103 There is always going to be some edge case that raises a vigorous
104 debate. I think the key is that we're having this argument over a
105 gray area that is really on the periphery of what we do. I don't
106 think that means we're compromising our core values - the fact that
107 we're so divided actually suggests to me that we take such matters
108 very seriously.
109
110 --
111 Rich

Replies

Subject Author
Re: [gentoo-nfp] Gentoo Social Contract and potential liabilities "Anthony G. Basile" <basile@××××××××××××××.edu>
Re: [gentoo-nfp] Gentoo Social Contract and potential liabilities Sven Vermeulen <swift@g.o>