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On 19/08/13 18:55, Neil Bothwick wrote: |
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> On Mon, 19 Aug 2013 11:17:06 +0100, Stroller wrote: |
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> |
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>> Here's a short, very in-comprehensive list of software we are aware |
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>> of that currently are not able to provide the full set of functionality |
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>> when /usr is split off and not pre-mounted at boot: |
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>> udev-pci-db/udev-usb-db and all rules depending on this (using the |
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>> PCI/USB database in /usr/share), PulseAudio, NetworkManager, |
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>> ModemManager, udisks, libatasmart, usb_modeswitch, gnome-color-manager, |
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>> usbmuxd, ALSA, D-Bus, CUPS, Plymouth, LVM, hplip, multipath, Argyll, |
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>> VMWare, the locale logic of most programs and a lot of other stuff. [1] |
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> |
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> How much of that is needed before the contents of /etc/fstab are |
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> mounted? I certainly don't need to run a desktop, used a 3G modem, play |
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> sounds or load a virtual machine before then. Yes, LVM may be needed, but |
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> the needed parts are in /sbin anyway, so that is a red herring too. |
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> |
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> I understand the need, even desire, of binary distros to cover all bases |
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> by taking the safer option, but Gentoo is about choice and all reasonable |
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> choices should be permitted. It comes down to what the council means by |
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> "not supported". If it means "will not work" that will cause problems for |
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> some, but if it means "you have to work it out for yourself", well, |
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> what's the point of a community if we can't work it out between us? |
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> |
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> |
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I rather suspect that they are going after the cloud/VM market ... |
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having VM's boot quickly and simply along with no desire/need to fault |
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find and repair ... just rm it and spin up another instance. |
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It makes sense in that market ... what doesn't is pushing it into areas |
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that are not appropriate and people dont want it. I think that Fedora |
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has largely dropped off peoples list of useful distros but more |
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interesting is how Redhat will go when these ideas start to get included |
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in RHE - last I heard that still has not happened. I did try Fedora as |
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a choice on our networking machines for students but took it off as no |
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one used it as it was just "not nice" - possibly the bad vibes of gnome3 |
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contributing - the surprise was linuxmint being more popular than |
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ubuntu. Gentoo is there but only as a specially configured command line |
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only tool so its not in the running. |
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I still have not seen an adequate explanation as to why systemd isn't a |
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profile as its far more intrusive than a gnome/kde choice and they have |
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profiles. That way some bad choices like polluting systems with systemd |
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files because they are only small and insignificant might be avoided. I |
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have used the mask method but did waste some time on chasing down odd |
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errors due to missing file errors in the logs so I would rather not have |
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them on the system at all. |
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So why not a profile so those guys who want to play can get a |
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configuration that better suits them? - and vice versa if the whole |
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systemd push dies and Redhat drops it as I doubt anyone else big enough |
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will pick it up (they have a foot in both camps at the moment). Smaller |
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distros that jump entirely systemd will be in trouble until they move back. |
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BillK |
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