[gentoo-user] Re: Gentoo is so AWESOME

[Steven J. Long]

Nicolas Sebrecht wrote:
> hasufell wrote:
> > You can use the command line too.
> >
> > www-client/pybugz
>
> I know this tool. I did try it. At that time it was buggy and did not
> work for me. Though, this would still be a busy process as this is just
> another interface og the bugzilla thing.

It's another command to run, just like git. As others have pointed out, the use of
a bug-tracker is important in terms of managing the process. That still stands.
 
> > Git workflow has been on the todo list for a long time, as well as
> > review systems such as gerrit.
> >
> > It is non trivial to implement
>
> Other than the git repository size requiring a huge initial clone, it's
> very easy to do. And yes, I've read all the headaches on the Gentoo
> mailing lists about the git migration.

Using git and accepting patches on a mailing-list wouldn't change the process you
discuss: it would just make everything harder to manage, and require more work on
the part of maintainers. And there are no people working full-time on Gentoo ebuilds,
in contrast to Linux kernel development.

So aiming for that as a model, is simply a bad idea: the circumstances and the time
available are radically different. As is the product.

> Also, Gentoo organization has two heads making ambitious dicisions hard
> to take. And AFAIKS, to decision process in Gentoo is not helping at
> all. We are far from how it worked at the genesis/beginning of Gentoo.

I don't agree: Gentoo is much stronger now. But more importantly I don't see this
as relevant in the slightest. You appear to be whinging basically, that you weren't
welcomed with open arms on the strength of your email to the list, so you emailed
again and "no-one cared." And going from there to drawing wider conclusions on a
the whole setup, as if that's the reason you were snubbed *sniffle*. Total non-
sequitur imo.

> > It is non trivial to implement and none of it is an excuse for not
> > contributing IMO ;)
> >
> > Those are enhancements and we are already working on it. Get your hands
> > dirty.
>
> Oh, yes. Pass the recruitement process to enhance the recruitement process,
> workflow and decision process (not possible to change, IMO). Funny! :-)

No: just contribute.

> Again, I proposed myself to the dev list two times in the past. Nobody
> cared and I had no answers.

Because that has never been the process: anyone can post to the mailing-list, it
doesn't mean anything. While I agree it would have been good if recruiters had
followed it up with you, if you're so new to Gentoo that you think the ML is how
to start, then I can see why people might feel you needed to learn more, perhaps
by reviewing the documentation. And if that's too much to ask, then perhaps you're
not cut out to be a Gentoo developer: ime you need to be more of a self-starter
just to use the distro.

Please don't get me wrong: I think the recruitment process could be improved, in
particular by having more developers working on it. And that does take a cultural
shift, in terms of seeing recruitment as important, and a desirable thing to work
on, as well as in terms of being more proactive and welcoming to newcomers, and to
external perspectives.

Neither of those change the fact that you don't join a team just by sending them
an email. Like it or not, there are social factors involved, or it wouldn't be
a team of people, however loosely associated.

And if you cba to review the basics, stuff most users know, or can find out easily,
what makes you think you're cut out to be a developer?

Please note I'm not discussing any technical ability you may or may not have with
bash, ebuilds or upstream sources. Just your ability to find out the basics, which
is much less difficult than installing Gentoo in the first place.

If you want/ed to be a developer, my advice would always be: show you're useful, not
that you need hand-holding and ego-stroking from the get-go.

-- 
#friendly-coders -- We're friendly, but we're not /that/ friendly ;-)