Re: [gentoo-user] tips on running a mail server in a cheap vps provider run but not-so-trusty admins?

[james]

On 8/28/20 4:56 PM, Grant Taylor wrote:
> On 8/28/20 1:55 PM, james wrote:
>> I'm proposing, via a small corp I own, to purchase up to (3) dual
>> Rasp.pi 4 setups of (2) R.Pi.4 8gig ram setups and send them to the
>> devs WE all decide on.
>
> A few points.
>
> 1)� I don't think that 8 GB of RAM is required.� --� My email server is
> a VPS with 2 GB of RAM and is running just fine.� So, maybe smaller
> systems would work.� And maybe that would mean that more of them could
> be acquired for the same funding.

OK, but I like the R.P.8gram quite a lots. so my money is with 
prototyping on via (3) innovators each with (2) R. P. 4 8g ram. Others 
can use what they want. Surely others can propose and use other embedded 
(low2 power) boards.


>
> 2)� I don't know that a Raspberry Pi is strictly required for the
> testing.� I think that anything that will run Gentoo can be used to
> prove out the software stack.� --� Sure, there will /eventually/ need to
> be /some/ testing on Raspberry Pis.� But I think that testing will be
> later in the game and more of a confirmation after the fact.

Great idea. Fund that pathway yourself. I LOVE R.PI.4 boards, with 8gig 
of ram. ymmv.

If we can get these codes running on arm64 (R.P.4) surely running them 
on AMD or intel is trivial?

Perhaps a read on "Intel cripple AMD functions is in order?

https://www.agner.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=6

>
> 3)� I'm not sure what you mean by "dual ... setups".

(2) identical R.Pi.4 8gig rams systems, running gentoo.
(1) dns resolver codes emails service codes etc
(1) dns resolver codes, webserver to support email services etc.


> What are the two
> systems (be it Raspberry Pis or VPSs or VMs or something else) supposed
> to do?� -� Are you wanting primary and backup (as in MX) or some sort of
> cluster with shared file system or something else?

Well establish, albeit, in long postings on this gentoo-user list. It's 
just (2) R.P.4 systems, running gentoo.

I'm open to the stack (list) of codes necessary to securely run

1. embedded gentoo on R.P.4 (other hardware can be funded by others).

2. Any number of robust email servers-systems (open)

3.  a DNS servers to provide "primary dns services"
a total of (2). More than 2 would be great.

4. A companion   ngnix(?) web server just to complement the project. The 
ideas is each email services collective could have their own web pages 
explaining their email and related services.

5. On these (3) projects, I'd be open to other, complementary 
experimentation, as long as it is published. Grant Taylor, do not let it 
go to your head, but I agree with most of what you write in Gentoo User.

6. (2) Rpi4 (8 gig) systems and extras are 2-3 hundred dollars. So it's 
total less than $900 USD dollars. NOT a bid deal for my little corp. 
Actually, if I get what I need, then it's the most inexpensive && robust 
way for my little corp to get exactly what I need. My own small email 
servers and dns resolvers supporting those email services.

>
>> Let's us start compiling up the codes, keep it simple (for now) and
>> implement them with gentoo-users as the testers of the email services.
>>
>> These discussions should be continued to everyone's benefit. However
>> there are way more than (3) folks on these threads who are most
>> capable to do this community prototyping.
>
> I think the idea of using VPSs or VMs means that a lot more people can
> participate using the same funding.

I'm not funding somebody else's idea. I'm funding what *I* want, open to 
input. With this effort others benefit from the project. The ultimate 
goals is for hundreds of email services to be setup, gentoo centric.


>> If WE do not act and get hundreds of these deployed, email, as we know
>> it via RFCS and other standards may just disappear, or be relegated
>> to the far reaches of the Internet.� What I have read, is standards
>> based email services, particularly by small organizations, are under
>> extreme pressure by large corporations to be marginalized out of
>> existence.
>
> I think I disagree with that.

OK, great. FUND what you want. Run things as you see fit


> Many of the big email operators are enforcing higher and higher
> standards.� But the standards /are/ /open/ and /can/ /be/ /implemented/
> /by/ /anyone/ who wants to do so.


Show me a concise, easy to follow set of codes and docs, and I'll just 
build (2) R.P.4 servers and share my docs 100%. Forget the fact, for 
now, that all static IPs Frontier has, are blocked by this same group of 
  higher and higher standards. Really, I'm kinda shocked NeddySeagoon, 
or others have not already fixed this, via 100% gentoo codes, complete 
with ample documentation.

https://wiki.gentoo.org/wiki/Raspberry_Pi4_64_Bit_Install

Just add the email, dns, ngnix, security setup codes to
this doc?

I have been researching and reading, for over (3) weeks and have yet 
been able to formulate a pathway to get a mail server up. Granted the 
industry black-balling Frontier, is a bit of a shocker to me. No wonder 
Frontier is is receivership, with Verizon licking their chops to get a 
big chunk of Frontier back.

Just in case you do not know, Verizon was force to divest much of their 
internet empire (Florida, Texas and California) to Frontier in 
anti-trust settlements.



> The /only/ thing that I've seen that is somewhat of a closed system that
> small players -- like myself -- have no real hop of is getting people
> like Google to trust our ARC (not DMARC) signatures.� Though this is
> probably more a shortcoming in the ARC specification as it doesn't
> tackle how to get providers to trust your signature as a small operator.

I can fix this problem, in a few months. There are legal places to take 
'racketeering' and other forms of 'monopolistic" behavior to for 
resolution. Email was created and spread via RFC standards. I do not 
user any of the services of those conglomerates. TRUMP is totally 
ignorant of what this does to small competitors. HE needs to be made 
aware. He is forcing big operations on the internet to choose between 
the US and China. The right presentation to him and his underlings, 
although not easy, is a doable.

It is an election year. Give me what I want/need, and I'll show him how 
thousands of US High School kids and start an email/webserver, centric 
business, right out of their own home.  That the sort of technology 
idea/commitment Trump or Biden needs right now!



Sounds like private discussions, via a connected DC lawyer can get this 
'horse shit' fixed. Done it too many times, all the way to 'testifying' 
in front of judges as an expert witness too many times. I can 'bust 
their balls' but will give them a chance to come clean first, via 
private negotiations. Getting political candidates to talk about this on 
their campaign trail, is easy, if you have THE RIGHT LAWYERS. They are 
often referred to as "Money Men". That, my friend, is how politics work, 
in reality.

And yes that's the sort of skills The Gentoo Council, should be looking for.



>
>> So any of the folks in these treads can announce publically, or send
>> me private email as to your concerns. Public is best, but, I
>> understand the needs for private communications sometimes. So yea,
>> I'll personally finaces, at least 6 months of (3) projects.
>> I'll take all input, but will make my (funding) decision, in a focus,
>> quick strategy.
>
> I'm happy to participate.� My preference would be to use a VPS / VM
> (which I can provide) and allow others to take advantage of the Pis that
> are on offer.

Both you and Ash, are on my short list. No doubts.  If you need 
financial help, after this is done and published, then contact me privately.

Ash already knows I wheel and deal. She has impeccable credentials, so 
all she has to do is ask.

Anyone can post with their ideas a solution.

And yes, I'm going to be quite generous and helpful. I'm a very 
comfortable techie; like many of the older gentoo hacks.......

Besides, the timing is right for this sort of open competition in email 
services. I would not worry about big tech falling in line.


https://foreignpolicy.com/2020/08/27/china-tech-facebook-google/

James