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On 2014-02-20 10:36 PM, Mark David Dumlao <madumlao@×××××.com> wrote: |
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> On Thu, Feb 20, 2014 at 8:53 PM, Tanstaafl <tanstaafl@×××××××××××.org> wrote: |
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>> Sorry, Canek, no offense was intended, but if you go back and re-read your |
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>> 'extremely overly enthusiastic' post (this plus the content is why I |
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>> referred to it as a 'rant'), while I agree with most everything you said, |
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>> your primary point - that it should be the people who *don't* want systemd |
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>> doing all of the work - was backwards, and that was what I wanted to point |
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>> out. |
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> I'm afraid this is the part that's backwards. |
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You are wrong. |
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>> So, please, don't take it as an insult. In fact you have done a very good |
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>> job of patiently spelling out the advantages of systemd, to the point I'm no |
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>> longer afraid of it taking over and devouring the linux world. |
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> If systemd truly is, as you say "taking over and devouring the linux world" |
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*I* never said that. Others have though, and some still apparently |
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believe this to be the case. Admittedly it is those voices that prompted |
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me to start this thread. I wanted to get opinions from other list |
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members about how systemd is/will/should impact the gentoo community, |
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and I'm glad I did. The result is that I now no longer believe most of |
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the negatives being spread about systemd, and no longer fear that it is |
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'taking over and devouring the linux world'. |
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> such that the majority of distro maintainers are individually |
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> choosing to use a feature or two from it, then yes, it definitely is |
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> the job of people who want to opt out of it to do the work. |
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You would be right IF - and I repeat IF - it weren't for the little |
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inconvenient fact that OpenRC, not systemd, is the default init system |
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in gentoo, now, and thankfully for the foreseeable future. I say |
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thankfully not because I fear systemd, but because I would much prefer |
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to let systemd mature with others using it to flesh out any bugs or |
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other problems/issues (technical *and* political). |
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As long as OpenRC is the default init system in Gentoo, it is on those |
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who want something *other* than OpenRC (ie, systemd) to do the work of |
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implementing it. |
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Why is it so difficult to see that? |
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Even Canek already acknowledged the correctness of this position. |
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>> Bottom line: since Gentoo's default and primary init system is (and |
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>> hopefully will be for a very long time) OpenRC, it is on the systemd folks |
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>> to do the work to get systemd fully supported. |
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> systemd IS supported and working. The problem arises when there are |
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> people that want to push for a "system with no systemd whatsoever" |
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> and act like it's the systemd maintainer's job to make that happen. |
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Thankfully there is no problem then, since no one is pushing for 'a |
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system with no systemd whatsoever', beyond what exists already. |
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All I am interested in is keeping the systemd proponents in their place. |
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As the 'new kid on the block', when 'invading' (for lack of a better |
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term) a new distro (in this case, gentoo), it is *on them* to provide |
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the methods and means for people interested in trying/using systemd on |
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said distro, but most importantly to do so *without* impacting existing |
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users who want to continue using the *existing*, *default* init system |
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for their distro. |
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Are you seriously disagreeing with this position? |