RE: [gentoo-amd64] Re: How To Play WMV (thread drift - slaveryware)

[Bob Young]

> -----Original Message-----
> From: richard.j.fish@×××××.com [mailto:richard.j.fish@×××××.com]On
> Behalf Of Richard Fish
> Sent: Friday, September 29, 2006 2:27 PM
> To: gentoo-amd64@l.g.o
> Subject: Re: [gentoo-amd64] Re: How To Play WMV (thread drift -
> slaveryware)
>
>
> On 9/29/06, Bob Young <BYoung@××××××××××.com> wrote:
> > That's a very shallow definition of the "essence of freedom," from the
> > perspective of most end users, your scenario doesn't really
> change anything.
> > From the end users perspective s/he is still dependent on
> someone else to
> > make the changes. I wouldn't say having a choice of who to be
> dependent upon
> > actually qualifies as "freedom."
>
> But the user can also choose to not be dependant upon anybody.  They
> can choose to learn about programming and languages and fix it
> themselves.  If you say you have no interest in doing that, then you
> are *choosing* to be dependant upon somebody, and now you have to pick
> who to become dependant on.  But that doesn't change the fact that you
> can still choose to not be dependant on anybody.  Sounds like
> "freedom" to me...

Technically yes, I've said that all along. However, in real world practical
terms, how truly *valuable* is this "freedom"...?

Would you go to war, or be willing to die for the "freedom" that open source
provides? If not, then equating it with the freedoms that real mean and
women have fought and died for is to marginalize the importance the word is
meant to convey.

I'm not saying that open source should be outlawed, or even that it
shouldn't be advocated for, as it does have some advantages. I'm just saying
that the quote unquote "freedom," that it provides, doesn't really justify
the use of words like freedomware and slaveryware.


> > > It absolutely is just like a car, or a house, or anything else.  If my
> > > house could only be modified by the original builder, it would never
> > > be modified -- I'd never even get a picture hung for want of being
> > > able to put a nail in a stud.  Now maybe I can't add a drawbridge to
> > > my house myself, I can't do the welding or design, but my friend
> > > could, and did.
> >
> > Analogies suck, software isn't a car, or a house, or anything else, it's
> > software. If you can't make you're point without analogies, maybe you
> > haven't thought it through clearly enough.
>
> Yes, all analogies are imperfect by definition.  But many people find
> that creating analogies to other industries and products helps them
> understand the issues.

I should have been more specific and said that *software* analogies suck.
The problem is that almost invariably the analogies are to three dimensional
objects in the physical world, and software isn't even one dimensional, and
thus, rarely do such analogies actually add any real clarity to the picture.

> > I consider the facts, and look at the reality of the situation,
> and decide
> > for myself what opinion to take.
>
> Fine.  But why should someone who believes that the terms
> "slaveryware" and "freedomware" are the most accurate reflection of
> *their* opinion stop using the terms?

For one, there isn't any good, factual, logical, basis to justify their use.
Secondly, the use of such words in relation to something as trivial as open
source, (trivial least in comparison to other things that freedom is
justifiably used in relation to), tends trivialize the meaning of the word
freedom.

--
Regards
Bob Young


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