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On 02/08/2016 10:09 PM, Rich Freeman wrote: |
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> On Mon, Feb 8, 2016 at 7:58 PM, Anthony G. Basile |
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<blueness@g.o> wrote: |
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>> |
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>> what does in-house tool mean? i'm a gentoo developer but i also work |
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>> on an upstream project (eudev) that 14 distros use. |
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>> |
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>> some of the criticism given here are my concerns as well and i've |
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>> spoken with the various distros --- slack, parted magic, puppy. they |
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>> get what's going on and they still see eudev is the best way forward |
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>> for now. it may not be in the future, but neither will a udev |
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>> extracted from a compiled full systemd codebase. |
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> |
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> How many of those 14 distros have more than 14 users? |
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> |
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> Look, I get it, some people don't like systemd. That's fine. |
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> However, you have to realize at this point that a non-systemd |
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> configuration is anything but mainstream. There will always be a |
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> "poppyseed linux" whose purpose in life seems to be to preserve linux |
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> without sysfs or some other obscure practice. I just think that |
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> Gentoo should offer the choice to do those things, but have a more |
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> mainstream set of defaults. |
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The new mainstream is docker. Docker recently switched to Alpine Linux, |
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which uses OpenRC+eudev: |
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https://www.brianchristner.io/docker-is-moving-to-alpine-linux/ |
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That dwarfs whatever marketshare systemd has in the same way that |
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Android+iOS dwarfed whatever marketshare Windows has. |
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If userbase is what matters to you, then OpenRC+eudev won. It is the |
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logical choice for those concerned about userbase because that is what |
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the Linux ecosystem will be using going forward. |
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I do not think userbase should be the sole means by which we make |
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decisions, but those that think otherwise should now join the |
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eudev+OpenRC camp. It has the bigger userbase share going forward. |
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To put it another way, the war is over. Welcome abroad. :) |
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>> |
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>> it needs to be in the new stage4s to make a bootable system. imo a |
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>> stage4 should be bootable modulo a kernel. |
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>> |
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> |
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> Sure, a stage4 based on systemd makes a lot of sense. I don't really |
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> see the point in leaving a kernel out though - I'd even stick a |
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> precompiled one in /boot on top of having the sources installed. Why |
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> not make a stage4 install something that takes all of 5 minutes? |
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> |
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> I think that offering an eudev-based distro as a default just doesn't |
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> make sense in 2016. I just think the better road to take is to start |
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> treating virtual/udev as something that gets installed post-stage3. |
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> We can't even get people to agree on vi vs emacs as a default. |
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We can leave virtual/udev out of stage3, but that doesn't diminish the |
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need to select sensible default for the virtual/udev provider. |
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